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Author Topic: Long span TLG?  (Read 972 times)
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brain52
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« on: March 17, 2013, 03:07:26 PM »

The technique that I use for launching my 1.5m RC gliders isn't really working for me while flying the smaller and lighter TLGs. It can get really painful! So far I've built a dynamite and a Spin f1n with a peg. The peg helped me alot but I still feel like I need something bigger. Any suggestions?

Brian
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sweepettelee
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« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2013, 03:58:19 PM »

Brian,
Since 1 meter is max span per AMA rules for FF HLG, you might like the 1 meter Spin F1N version that Stan B & Tm B are flying currently.
Still, I am somewhat surprised you have pain from Launching. Is it possible you are letting your glider & arm lead your body, instead of
your body leading the arm & glider?
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Leeper
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« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2013, 04:20:32 PM »

I'm with Leeper - not sure if a longer span model will help  Undecided

I know Mark Benns (who I think is a member) flies some 'biggies' (The largest is 42" I think)

Maybe I'll come over all Chinese for a moment and say that in any movement your intention leads, followed by your Chi (Energy) and lastly comes the movement. (Probably no help at all, but it makes sense inside my little fevered mind) Wink

Ah well, blame the fact that we've just got back from choosing a new puppy Grin
Paul
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sweepettelee
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« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2013, 04:45:24 PM »

So Paul DaddyO, using ancient Chinese yin-yang mysticism,
that logically reasons that your "puppy" has short "wingspan"?
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Leeper
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« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2013, 04:51:02 PM »

Brian,

I'm a newb with DLG, and did have some trouble moving from TLG to DLG.  But then, my first day with DLG I put up a LOT of launches, and my back stiffened up.  Next time I flew I had no trouble.

But I suspect that the issue is that you might not be using the same technique for both.  With DLG you are likely launching fairly level, maybe just up a bit--can't launch too steep or get tip strikes as you come around.  With the shorter span TLG, you may be trying to hard to launch upward to compensate for the lack of a preset.  Have you had any video taken of your launch?  Where are you getting the pain?  Try and make sure you are throwing the glider closer to level--aim at the tops of some distant trees.  As you get more used to it, you can launch more upward.

Really, the techniques aren't all that much different, IMO.  Jon Sayre studied the DLG flyers when he took up TLG, and I studied Jon and eventually came to my own style.  As Leeper said, make sure you keep the glider back--keep your coil as long as possible.  It may be that you are used to needing to accelerate a ~300 gram glider, and a glider of ~100 grams (or much less in the case of the Dynomite) doesn't take much.  Think more in terms of throwing.  The DLG I think a bit more in terms of flying it around, since I am using a blade there and just gripping the tip of my TLG.

Leeper, I think Stan is flying a 36-inch SpinF1N.  Tim was using the full meter; but not sure if he still is.  At the Ike Stan told me that he prefers the smaller span, if I remember correctly.

--Bill
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brain52
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« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2013, 05:21:27 PM »

As near as I can tell, from the video that I've taken of myself flying 1.5m vs. others flying TLG we have two distinct techniques. I also know that I'm trying to compare apples to oranges here Undecided What I think is happening, is that the FF glider is so much smaller and lighter than what I'm used to I tend to over-rotate, or whip too hard. The pain feels like all of my joints want to seperate and all the blood in my arm wants to go to the tips of my fingers! After installing the peg I had much better control over my launch, and I'm getting good flights out of it compaired to before. But once I go for a full power launch I tend to have issues for a few days after  Embarrassed

The 1m Spin F1N sounds like my best bet for the moment
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brain52
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« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2013, 05:35:22 PM »

Thanks!
Once I started using the peg I was able to launch flat, as I do with the DLG. And that's when I started to have alot more fun with TLG. But it's also when I started to try launching much harder. I'll have to get some video of my TLG launches and post them. I'm working on a couple more 36" Spin F1Ns with RDT so I can get more practice launches in.

Brian
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sweepettelee
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« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2013, 05:36:36 PM »

Bill, etal, I just found out Stan is flying 36" flat span(approx 34" proj)
Spin F1Ns. So you posted the correct info, not me.
It seems only Tim, Jim Buxton and possibly one or two other US TLG flyers
are currently flying 1 meter FF TLGS.
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Leeper
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« Reply #8 on: March 18, 2013, 02:29:10 AM »

I have been flying 1 metre span version of my Morris dancer and did build a 48" version (which I think Leeper saw when he stayed with me last year) on the assumption that bigger is better...WRONG!! If using standard tapered carbon tubes supplied by Stan or Kite tubes, all sorts of nasties occur during launch to the point that it becomes a fruitless exercise.
I did build a 42" version that showed potential by never pursued it as the 36" to 1 metre projected span will deliver the goods and that has been more than proven in competition in the UK, US and OZ.

I use the wing tip peg, more comfortable and better leverage but it is horses for courses.

Ployd in OZ
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DaddyO
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« Reply #9 on: March 18, 2013, 03:41:41 AM »

So Paul DaddyO, using ancient Chinese yin-yang mysticism,
that logically reasons that your "puppy" has short "wingspan"?

Indeed  Cheesy Cheesy
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« Reply #10 on: April 05, 2013, 08:38:55 PM »

...The pain feels like all of my joints want to seperate and all the blood in my arm wants to go to the tips of my fingers! After installing the peg ...The 1m Spin F1N sounds like my best bet for the moment
Hi Brian.
i hadn't flown my A2Z.com Maxima30 TLG for about two years but played hooky today and flew it at the riverside ayso field. I use the finger only grip and sandpaper with the four longer fingers on top and thumb underneith and didn't have any discomfort after two years of non-flying tlg style. I also only rotate about 300' degrees, no running or jumping for this fat guy Cheesy
That said i know exactly what you mean about the tingling and soreness- when i fly my Gambler 50" rc-dlg with peg= from the first rc-dlg launch until the next day, a lot of discomfort then soreness .
The only thing i can think is one's hand is in a normal position wrist wise with the finger-tlg style and the forearm/wrist is getting stretched in an unnatural manner with the peg style DLG. Your mileage will vary...
Say hi to Norm and good luck on the Spin tlg's, john s.
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brain52
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« Reply #11 on: April 05, 2013, 09:51:03 PM »

The more I look at this the more I see what I'm doing wrong. My follow through is pretty bad with the TLG, and I'm wayyy over rotating. I should probably go back to the basic side arm launch?

http://youtu.be/vWwUzFbKkIE
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« Reply #12 on: April 05, 2013, 11:24:28 PM »

Brian,

The video shows up as private when I click on the link.

Without seeing the video, my guess is that you don't need to go back to basic sidearm, althought it might help you initially: My suggestions is to focus on keeping the arm and glider lagging waaaaay behind.  That's the biggest thing.  Then focus on keeping the elbow straight and reaching out toward your target on the follow-through.

Since you don't need to get the glider flying around, and there isn't much weight of the glider to keep it lagging, you need to focus on keeping the arm back as far as possible before actually throwing it.

My 2 cents.  I'll revisit when I can see the video.

--Bill
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brain52
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« Reply #13 on: April 06, 2013, 10:10:10 AM »

Sorry, the video should work now.
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sweepettelee
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« Reply #14 on: April 06, 2013, 02:24:56 PM »

Brian, it works fine now.
Will we see you hurling at San Valeers Annual next weekend?
Most of the usual suspects should be there...
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Leeper
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« Reply #15 on: April 06, 2013, 02:52:27 PM »

Brian,

After seeing the video, I agree with your comments and I also think my comments were correct.  Remember that the mass of the glider helps keep the RC glider back and accelerating smoothly.  With the smaller TLG, it takes a conscious effort to do that.  Even after flying for years, it's something I remind myself.  Keep it way back, release just a bit earlier perhaps, and reach toward the target on the follow-through.  The last bit will also help with the overrotation you mentioned.

Wish I was going to the San Valeers.  I may have another trip to SoCal in the near future, and I was trying to time it for a contest.  But don't think it's going to work out, certainly not for next weekend.  I've been working too much, and haven't even repaired my TLG from the violent thermal-induced crash at the Isaacson.  This weekend, I'm fixing some delaminations on my DLG so that I can get back out practicing before my swampy FF field is dry.

Regards,
Bill
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lincoln
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« Reply #16 on: April 06, 2013, 05:40:26 PM »

I recently found a way to sort of practice launches at home in my back yard. I bet a couple of extra sessions each week, on weekdays, will help with technique and physical toughness. I have a thin slat of cedar meant for cedar closets, maybe 4 feet long. When I tlg it, it spins wildly and only goes 20 feet or so due to all the drag. Pitch feels a bit funny, but I'm sure there's a solution. Perhaps a forward weight on the tip and a trailing weight next to my hand, though I don't know how that would affect the distance.
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brain52
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« Reply #17 on: April 09, 2013, 03:28:03 PM »

Brian, it works fine now.
Will we see you hurling at San Valeers Annual next weekend?
Most of the usual suspects should be there...

I'll be there Lee
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« Reply #18 on: March 07, 2017, 05:17:10 AM »

Hi chaps, sorry to resurrect an old thread, but I just wanted to check if we have a span limit for FF handlaunch in the UK? Just read the rules and it doesn't mention anything I could see. Or is there any other size limit? ie weight or wingloading etc that is relevant.

Cheers,
Jon
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