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Author Topic: Need a little Ambroid glue!  (Read 1550 times)
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Nina
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« on: October 29, 2014, 02:51:20 AM »

Hello!

I am joining on behalf of my elementary science teacher in days of old who does not do the computer thing.  I am now 48 years old, and he somewhat older than I.  He is and was then already an avid model airplane and ship-in-a-bottle model builder, and he teaches youth too how to do this to the present.  He is desperately hoping to FIND some Ambroid glue to buy.....even just a little bit.  That would be SO TERRIFIC! He lives on Whidbey Is. Wa. U.S.A.  He is going to teach some kids this in the next few weeks and is almost out.  He says nothing works as well.

Please if you CAN help.....do let us know where we can buy some........ for the sake of wonderful teachers who leave this world and our lives better than they were!

:-)

Sincerely,

:->

Nina
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Beazld
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« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2014, 05:11:04 AM »

I have been unable to find Ambroid forbsome time now. I have switched to Testors green tube or Sigment for solvent based glues and I am beginning to use more Titebond alphetic.
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« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2014, 07:12:13 AM »

to my knowledge (and I have tried finding some so I can sell it to people like you), Ambroid is No Longer Available.  Therefore, I carry SigMent, Testors Green, and Duco.  Not the same, I am told, but what are you gunna do?

--george
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Otakar
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« Reply #3 on: November 18, 2016, 12:39:36 PM »

I now have plenty in stock. It is not the Brand Amrpoid@ but the aviation grade version. Otherwise it is pure Nitrocellulose cement like the early Ambroid@ I have it in 2oz (dispensing) and 4.1oz(refill) containers. You can PM me. or email me. I don't always checks my PMs, but my emails every half an hour or so. I ship in the US.
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Greg Langelius
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« Reply #4 on: November 19, 2016, 10:08:07 AM »

I would suggest that the nostalgia for Ambroid may be a bit misplaced.

Many decades ago, the original Ambroid recipe was changed to make it very similar, if not functionally identical, to most other cellulose acetate cements. I believe this transition took place before my birth. I am now 70. In the original guise, the cement took its color from the stock it was made out of. That stock became unavailable and its replacement was clear. Ambroid added pigment to this new formula to simulate the original shade. Another source cites the cellulose component as cotton. Since Nitrocellulose is sometimes referred to as gun cotton, I guess the distinction is very small. Yet another source cites Ambroid's original source of cellulose as old eyeglass frames. Somewhere in all of this, the truth (or truths) reside.

Later, Citric Acid was added when the lead tubes were introduced. The lead gave the cement a tendency to congeal within the tube. Camphor was the original plasticizer in Ambroid. Lead tubes have long since been replaced with annealed aluminum, and many more are now made from plastics.

In most part, the currently available Cellulose Acetate glues may vary in terms of the solvent mix and the plasticizer additive, but their main compositions are all awfully close to being the same. These same original nitrocellulose glues were further developed as the original nitrate aircraft dopes. Their intense flammability led to their replacement with more modern formulas. Some of us older campers still carry a bit of cellulose acetate glue along on their travels to serve as a fire building aid.

Back in the days. My Elder Brothers made some tries at mixing microfilm solution, which has some similarities. They used Castor Oil as their plasticizer.

The one attribute I can remember about Ambroid was the comment my Elder Brother made that it never stopped shrinking, and was probably the root cause of a lot of warps. True? I guess, who knows? My best guess is that Ambroid may come up a little bit short on its plasticizer content, which should make it a bit more rigid.

I would suggest any of the more popular cellulose acetate cements including Sigment, 527, Duco, Wal-Mart cement, and the aviation grade nitrocellulose cement offered by Otakar above in this thread. Some may wish to keep a little bit of castor oil handy for use as a plasticizing additive.

My first cement was Comet.

If you absolutely must have the amber color, try dissolving a tiny bit of Rit Rust colored powdered dye in a little bit of thinner and mixing it with the clear cement. I once used this technique to simulate the color of Spar Varnish on a Whale Boat model I built for a restaurant.

I should also note that trying to use Rit as a coloring agent with Urethane lacquers tends to curdle the liquid (so work fast...), and may contribute to a greater hardness in the resultant coating.

Greg
« Last Edit: November 19, 2016, 10:52:14 AM by Greg Langelius » Logged

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« Reply #5 on: November 19, 2016, 11:35:24 AM »

A better anti shrink material than castor oil is a product available on Amazon.  I can not remember the chemical name ( I looked it up it is Tricresyl phosphate) but it was one that the indoor flyers used to use a lot.  I use 10 drops per OZ of nitrate and that seems to work.  The material is a Graco product TSL #206994.  The TSL stands for throat seal liquid.  It is something like $10 for a 8 OZ bottle which will last a very long time.
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Otakar
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« Reply #6 on: November 19, 2016, 01:44:49 PM »

Actually, the reason it was called "gun-Cotton" is because it resembled "cotton candy" and was used as an explosive. Today it is still manufactured the same way but more purified, hence the more white instead of yellow color and it is stored in alcohol to make it not explosive, only flammable. It however will turn yellow with time. It is not as much UV sensitive as it will oxidize. If it sits in the container long enough even with it being closed, it will turn yellow. I have bought batches which were a couple of years old and they were yellow. The fresh batch I just bought is almost crystal clear. It will also turn in time though.
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« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2017, 09:22:16 AM »

While this is an old thread, I just wanted to say that I’m located on whidbey island also.. love that jet noise!
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Otakar
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« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2017, 10:10:45 AM »

Old thread but still active. NC Cement is still popular as ever, as I have found out.
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« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2017, 11:21:52 AM »

I use it to repair tears in silk and tissue covering.  Apply a bead, cover it with plastic and let it dry.  Remove the plastic and the tear is nice and even on each side with no curling of the edges.  Cut a patch of silk or tissue and clear dope on.  Apply enough coats of clear to fill the weave then paint (or dope) on the matching color. 
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Crabby
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« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2017, 11:33:29 AM »

Ambroid is the magic vapour of memories...just the sight of a tube of it sends me back in time. And the aroma? Second only to Mom's apple pie.
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Otakar
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« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2017, 11:44:30 AM »

I can't help you with the traditional classic tube part of it but the Aroma and smile that follows I still can. Out of 7 gals I bought, I still have maybe a Gallon left. Maybe a bit less. I still sell a few bottles a month on eBay. Its uses are about limitless. Besides building models and adhering tissue, I use it to make wood-filler for my rifle stocks.
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« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2017, 01:36:52 PM »



There is one modeling liquid that smells even better than Amberoid----Testors Solid-Model Sanding Sealer.

The last that I had was a box of the 15 cent size bottles left over from when my father closed his hobby shop  in the late 1970s.  Used it up on H/L gliders.

The smell was a bit less acrid than Amberoid, but Amberoid sure was fun to chew off your fingers.

Louis

PS: My dad's store was DeSoto Hobby Shop in downtown Memphis. I'd love to hear from any former customers. 

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« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2017, 02:44:11 PM »

I just bought a 4 oz tube from Model Merchants on Ebay called Sigment Model Cement that smells and acts just like the Ambroid i used for years. Model Merchants 541-972-3330. HOPE THIS HELPS.
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Otakar
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« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2017, 03:04:33 PM »

Sigment is not a Nitro acetate it is a Butyl acetate. It works OK but the adhesion is nowhere as good as Nitro. It is the same difference as Nitrate dope and Butyrate dope. You can buy the Butyrate cement from McMaster-Carr. It is OK but not GOOD.

EDIT;
What gives it away is that it is "fuel proof" Ambroid is not. That is also the difference between the dopes. All the solvents in Nitrocellulose cement are Hygroscopic and will mix with the moisture in the wood. This is one of the features of good penetration and good adhesion. This is why Aviation adhesives are Nitrate and not Butyrate.
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