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Author Topic: VMC cookup?  (Read 12671 times)
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #225 on: September 11, 2017, 03:48:47 AM »

Pete, you simply have to double up the flying wires, although the landing ones should of course be single, and don't forget all the aileron and tail-surface horns and wires!   Grin
Jon, you're a cruel and evil man. It's not big, it's not clever, and nobody's laughing.
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #226 on: September 11, 2017, 03:55:16 AM »

Seriously though, one of the things which always appealed to me about kit scale is the fact that you don't need to worry much about accuracy or fine details; the rules give you a perfect excuse to just build something to the plan quickly and fly it. I'm starting to realise that Andrew's "small details can be added" can be something of a double edged sword! (but only if if you've got the kind of brain which taunts itself  Cheesy)
« Last Edit: September 11, 2017, 05:01:10 AM by Pete Fardell » Logged
Jack Plane
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« Reply #227 on: September 11, 2017, 05:38:40 AM »


Jon, you're a cruel and evil man. It's not big, it's not clever, and nobody's laughing.


I know, I know... I've let myself down, my school down, my entire family and all our ancestors down, my mates, my dog...  Sad

A good compromise though would be just the basic inter-plane rigging, no doubling or any malarky, just enough to 'suggest' WW1 biplane.

If a KS monoplane doesn't need - and would be penalised for - all those exposed control surface cables and horns, then neither your SE nor my Camel shall have them!  Cheesy
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #228 on: September 11, 2017, 06:16:47 AM »

A good compromise though would be just the basic inter-plane rigging, no doubling or any malarky, just enough to 'suggest' WW1 biplane.
Which is sort of what I've done, although I baulked at the side cross wires between the struts and the two extra flying wires which go to the middle of the top wing. So long as you get a general criss-cross effect I think it still says 'WW1 bipe'.

Rigging aside, one thing I like about Andrew's VMC designs is that they include just the vital details which help define each specific type. On the SE5 it's the weird tail skid, rocker covers and long exhaust pipes, the flat nose with its slats of course, and maybe the odd flared front uc legs. Even without adding any extra details, these things already make a relatively simple kit into a much more convincing model.
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Snaky Stringer
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« Reply #229 on: September 12, 2017, 04:40:47 AM »

I just learned from the co-proprietor of my local model shop that following on from a visit to a Birmingham show he is about to receive some VMC kits as a sort of straw in the wind. I tremble in anticipation.  Shocked Most of the modellers round here seem to be RC types but of course some of them may be into miniature RC. I wonder which kits he'll get? I have a KK SE5 and remember seeing an SE5 flying beautifully some thirty odd years ago at a meeting in Nottingham. The builder died shortly afterwards. Unfortunately I can't remember his name. The KK kit seems to have an awful lot of wood in it and so far I haven't been really tempted, tending to prefer WW2 low wingers on the whole, apart from a few exceptions.
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Andrew Darby
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« Reply #230 on: September 12, 2017, 05:05:37 AM »

Last time I was up at the VMC works a few weeks back they had just done a shop counter pop up "variety box" so it maybe that he will have a few different ones.  The price the shop will charge is the same as if you buy it from the VMC website direct (the post is free) if you wanted more choice.  Although I think that is good to try and support your local model shop.  Grin.  I supported my local one since boyhood, but it just shut down as the old man died and his wife didn't want to carry on and neither did anyone else  Sad

The VMC SE5a is no way as light as something that you could do with laminated tips and 1/16" square fusalage longerons etc, but there is a lot less wood than the KK one (although having said that my KK one flies very well!)

I wouldn't have gone for a bipe at one time.  But folks like Pete, Dan Mellor, Monz, ZK-AUD etc made me re-evaluate my thoughts on them.  I really enjoy building and flying some of the earlier stuff now! Cool

Andrew
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Snaky Stringer
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« Reply #231 on: September 12, 2017, 05:51:52 AM »

I agree that supporting your local model shop is a good idea, especially as there fewer and fewer of them nowadays and those that remain tend not to stock rubber power kits. However, buying online is easy and usually cheaper, although postage charges from the good ole USA are a bit steep. I have a huge stash of unbuilt kits, but my daughter has just found a chap who has a thirteen year old son who is plane crazy and in the Air Cadets. They are currently building a Guillows Spitfire - the little one, which has much too much wood in it and a horrible plastic cowl but makes quite a pretty model and may fly. The small Guillows Hellcat is a good flyer and with a bit of lightening and a balsa cowl could probably be very good. Generally, I prefer Comet kits. I think I may have found a good home for some of my surplus stash. I also like the small Guillows Warhawk, which also needs a lot of wood reducing surgery.

I have studied the VMC catalogue and there is certainly a very wide choice. I have a lot of the KK and Veron kits and also quite a few downloaded plans of the ones that seemed to have disappeared before I got into modelling in the 'seventies, when I was already old enough to know better but was utterly hooked. Modelling had a very beneficial effect on my psyche, which was a bit bruised at the time as a result of a failed mariage. 
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rgroener
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« Reply #232 on: September 26, 2017, 04:52:27 AM »

I added some details to my Moth... The rigging is still pending... but it will be done before Nijmegen.
I also found a brave pilot who is willing to fly with my plane. He might not be good looking, but for sure it must be a bold guy to do it...
Next will be some more trimming flights. The nose button was loose, I had to readjust it and want to check if it is right again...
Hope to provide some flight pics without the clay on the nose.

Roman
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #233 on: September 26, 2017, 05:02:40 AM »

Very nice, Roman! Love the trailing scarf.
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« Reply #234 on: September 26, 2017, 05:38:30 AM »

That looks great Roman  Smiley
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danmellor
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« Reply #235 on: September 26, 2017, 11:11:00 AM »

Lovely!

Should be a good one...

Dan.
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Jack Plane
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« Reply #236 on: September 26, 2017, 02:18:28 PM »

Roman - that looks brill, and love the cockpit-dude - look forward to meeting him in Nijmegen!

Jon
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Pit
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« Reply #237 on: September 29, 2017, 08:43:43 AM »

Really nice, Roman!  I'm already regretting not being able to attend this year Sad.
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rgroener
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« Reply #238 on: September 30, 2017, 11:02:23 AM »

Thanks everybody, but be sure, it looks better in the picture than in real life...

I did some more detailing on the Moth. The rigging is done and I added some windshields. Working on the windshields was painful... These little beasts are just to flimsy... I invested quite some time in producing them, but still, they dont look so nice...

For the moment I am done with finishing. Next I will invest some time in trimming and flying. I tried a take off from the ground and it looked quite nice. But I have to trim it for a longer rubber.

In the mean time I found out, that it wasn't a very good idea to not dope the tissue before adding some acrylic colours... As soon as the air moisture is increasing, The tissue looks crumpled. Anyway... now its too late to correct that...
Weight as seen without rubber is 29g. It could be lighter (it can always be lighter Roll Eyes) but the Moth looks nice in flight and the speed is somehow scale like.

One problem I had was, that the rear peg is very high. Maybe to get a nice thrust line? Anyway... it is so high, that it was nearly impossible to install a Pilot. My solution with just a flat piece of balsa wood an the pilot head on it. And this is still touching the rubber slightly...

Over all, I am very happy with my Tiger Moth. It was a very nice build and it seems to fly well. I still have to fine tune the setting, but it looks promising so far.


Roman

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Jack Plane
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« Reply #239 on: October 01, 2017, 11:15:24 AM »

That's a very respectable weight Roman - for a well detailed VMC model!

With the peg well forward, I assume experimenting with a heavier motor won't radically alter the balance, so no extra dead weight will be needed in the nose?
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rgroener
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« Reply #240 on: October 01, 2017, 02:06:04 PM »

Jon, it looks so. My last try was with a 5cm longer loop and it didn't change the CG to much.
If the rubber is fully unwound, you never know how it settles in the fuselage. But until now, there where still plenty of turns in the rubber at the landing.
I didn't try it with full power.

Roman
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #241 on: October 21, 2017, 05:58:27 PM »

A good chance to try out the SE5 at Alfreton today. It didn't take much to get it airborne at all, and no panics or heart in mouth moments of any kind- all testament to the soundness of Andrew's design.
I added 3g inside the noseblock to get the balance point just behind the top wing's spar as specified and  it was soon ROGing and circling with the aid of my usual acetate trim tab to keep the port wing up. Rudder is set straight and the circuits are still quite tight, but I wanted to stay well away from the walls. I'll open it up more at Nijmegen. 14 inch motor is  more or less the same as supplied and recommended in the kit (but 4 strands of 3/32 rather than two of 3/16).
Room for improvement still, and the descent is a bit steep at the end, but this will do me for now.
A.u.w with motor and noseweight is 37.6g.
Two vids:
About 600 and 700 winds respectively I think...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0nQ3TlWtns
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mn6G8HNaXA
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Jack Plane
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« Reply #242 on: October 22, 2017, 12:43:04 AM »

Hurrah!  The SE5a is flying a treat for its first time out.

If no rudder, what's keeping it in the (tight) circle?  Just torque, no side-thrust adjustment to the prop?

Jon

PS Alfreton looks like a clean sizeable hall; how many of you there?
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Andrew Darby
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« Reply #243 on: October 22, 2017, 06:10:50 AM »

Looks good Pete, opening the turn for the larger hall will see a decent altitude... Grin

Andrew
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #244 on: October 22, 2017, 06:56:20 AM »

I think I'll need right rudder in order to open out the left hand circle. It's a bit of a shame that I originally half slit through the right side of the rudder line in order to bend it left, so I hope it doesn't fall off altogether when I force it the other way!
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« Reply #245 on: October 22, 2017, 08:12:53 AM »

Those were some good flights Pete. I'd leave the rudder as is and introduce a bit more right thrust. Dan's gas Se5 also looks great.
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #246 on: October 22, 2017, 09:29:42 AM »

Those were some good flights Pete. I'd leave the rudder as is and introduce a bit more right thrust.
Thanks Monz- that sounds like a plan. Funnily enough, Bill was wondering yesterday about whether to use rudder or side thrust to induce turn in indoor rubber models. I always tend towards rudder as I feel it to be a safer way to change the circle size without messing too much with anything else. I have absolutely no logic to back that up though!

(Also, I suppose rudder is a tidier looking option unless you've got a Gizmo geezer or some such.)
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« Reply #247 on: October 22, 2017, 11:30:14 AM »

Those looked like really good flights to me and I'd be completely satisfied with those results.  You're obviously more demanding of your aeroplanes than me.
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #248 on: October 22, 2017, 12:20:58 PM »

Thanks, and don't get me wrong, I am delighted with the way it flies, and for its first outing the tight (non-nerve jangling) circles were a real boon. What's more it means that when necessary I can probably fly it safely in pretty much any of the smaller halls used for indoor flying meets in this country. I will coax it into a larger circle at Nijmegen though, or else it'll just look like a small fly buzzing around in the middle.
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« Reply #249 on: October 22, 2017, 06:49:18 PM »

Nice flights with your Se5A Peter. I would like to suggest using a bit of tip weight on the right wing to open the turn together with Monz's suggestion of some more right thrust.
The advantage of using tip weight is that it will reduce the bank angle without requiring yaw to the right and would look more balanced.
John
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