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Author Topic: Peck-Polymers Andreason BA-4B Build  (Read 2766 times)
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abl
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« Reply #25 on: February 20, 2017, 04:22:02 AM »

New struts are made and installed (almost as though it's always been that way; no-one need ever know about the Strut Incident), and the model is now all in one piece; it's not completely finished (needs a few details), but it is flight-ready. The prop has been trimmed to 5.35" diameter which I'm hoping will allow take-offs, and some basic test-glides have revealed a requirement for a bit of nose weight. I put it on the scales this morning and <sharp intake of breath> it weighs 14 grams without rubber! I don't think it'll be troubling the top of the timesheets Smiley . However, I don't really mind that - it's the first Peanut I've built for a long time.

I'm not certain where extra weight has come from; the noseblock assembly is about 3.2 grams which for a peanut is probably a bit hefty (3/64" wire, dictated by the size of the hole in the propeller, I guess), and looking back on the build thread I think the wood was probably a bit heavy (although light stuff was used for the tail surfaces). I suspect that most of the weight went on when the cowling parts were added, and when the undercarriage was installed; maybe there was a bit too much epoxy, and maybe it could have used smaller diameter wire?

I'm going to take Jon's advice and try it outside before the next indoor session (which will be mid-March). And if I can find someone to do the honours, I'll see if I can get a flight video.
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ZK-AUD
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« Reply #26 on: February 20, 2017, 04:54:38 AM »

Very nice indeed. Neatly executed!   If you wanted you could run a bead of slightly thinned RC56 Canopy glue along those strut fairings onto the tissue.  It dries nice and clear, and being latex based it won't pull the tissue and you'll get a bit more strength.  Tempted to build one of these myself.
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OZPAF
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« Reply #27 on: February 20, 2017, 06:15:06 PM »

Great effort - good luck with it's trim flights

John
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abl
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« Reply #28 on: February 22, 2017, 09:48:45 AM »

Thanks, guys  Smiley

I've now added the final bits of detail (fuel tank filler, windscreen and a facsimile of an instrument panel) so it's officially finished - see pictures.

The instrument panel was made by scanning the (black) instrument panel and altering it in paint shop pro until it looked closer to the real one (aluminium panel with black instruments).

I might add a few more minor details if it survives to the Nationals, but basically I think that's it.

If I was building another, what would I do differently? Not a lot:
  • Take a bit more care over wood selection; I don't think the leading edges or longerons need to be that hard.
  • Add 1/16" sq supports to the top wing and an extra rib to the bottom wing for the interplane struts.
  • Move the rear motor peg further forward a bit because it doesn't quite fit my winding stooge.
  • Make a new F4 rather than trying to make the existing one fit.
  • Maybe use slightly thinner U/C wire.
  • For me, dope and thinners works better than a glue stick for attaching tissue.
  • Use small pegs/bits of wire as locators for wings & strut ends.

I've added .png files for the instrument panel and lettering in case they might be useful to someone...
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FLYACE1946
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« Reply #29 on: February 22, 2017, 11:02:05 AM »

abl you are really on to something nicely done.
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MKelly
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« Reply #30 on: February 22, 2017, 03:16:10 PM »

Very nice!
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Jack Plane
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« Reply #31 on: February 24, 2017, 10:46:32 AM »

Looks very good!

I was a bit worried that the Good Woman was going to keep insisting that we have a Spring break in direct conflict with the Indoor Nats weekend  Angry but I've managed to scheme a cunning plan that gets us back by Friday evening!

Only problem now is that I've got to now make a start on my identical Peanut BA-4B  Shocked or Andy will never let me hear the end of it...!
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abl
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« Reply #32 on: February 24, 2017, 03:21:23 PM »

Looks very good!

Thanks very much! :-)

Only problem now is that I've got to now make a start on my identical Peanut BA-4B  Shocked or Andy will never let me hear the end of it...!

I have a loft-full of part-completed projects, and it's just taken me about a year to finish a PSS project that was first started back in about 2007 (!) - I'm in no position to make any sort of cutting remark about people not getting on with things!  Smiley

Andy
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Mark Braunlich
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« Reply #33 on: March 16, 2017, 04:47:48 PM »

from the files
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Mark
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« Reply #34 on: March 17, 2017, 10:38:13 AM »

Thanks for putting these up Mark

Jon
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abl
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« Reply #35 on: March 19, 2017, 10:33:07 AM »

Here's a slightly stally (and short) Andreasson test flight from yesterday (Saturday):

https://vimeo.com/209076618 - many thanks to Jack Plane for the video.

That was 450 turns on an 11.5" loop of 3/32"; tried it later on 750 turns and it definitely needs more down thrust and possibly a little bit more right thrust, so I'll re-set the prop-shaft angle for next time out.

It needed just over 2 grams of nose weight, so I regret to report that it now weighs 16.16 grams without rubber. And I can state with confidence that taking the trouble to move the rear motor peg forwards and then leaving it about 3mm in front of the stabilizer leading edge was a bad idea, as it's very difficult to get fingers on the peg; should really have moved it forwards an entire bay, hopefully saving a bit of nose weight in the process.

I have a feeling that it might benefit from slightly wider rubber (maybe 7/64"), but over-powering indoor models is one of my bad habits so we'll see what it's like on max turns (1200-ish). Also, I have an idea that a better propeller might be worth trying. Might even think about carving one (I have old knife cuts on every finger of my left hand and some fingers of my right hand from carving propellers...).
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OZPAF
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« Reply #36 on: March 19, 2017, 06:21:00 PM »

The landing looked great! I think you have a potentially nice flying model there.

John
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abl
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« Reply #37 on: March 21, 2017, 07:46:47 AM »

Thanks - I think/hope you might be right; it has that "planted" feel to it (unlike the other model that I was attempting to trim at the same time).
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Crabby
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« Reply #38 on: March 25, 2017, 08:53:53 AM »

ABL great job on a great Peck classic!...This plane has long been a favorite and it has never let me down by flying erratically, or doing silly things whilst people are watching. My Dad, Thee Olde Man, (RIP) always yearned to build one that was lighter than the previous, he built several and I have his latest (in red) which weighs 9 gr. with rubber. Mine (the blue, cruder lazy man's version without the torsion struts) weighs 11 gr without rubber. I have built two, this one was part of a 24 hr. challenge build over on SFA. I was so balsa-sick after the build, I finger wound it and literally threw it out the front door into the early am darkness, and collapsed on the couch. When the sun rose I went out and found it a block away in a neighbors tree. I have cranked out some very tranquil flights with this ugly sister, and she is soo tough, having been tangled in an olde ladies' purple hair once and in the moving spokes on a kids bike once. "There but for the grace....."
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FLYACE1946
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« Reply #39 on: March 25, 2017, 10:47:02 AM »

Crabby the story you related reminded me of my first PP Andreason Build. I had made so many repairs that I resorted to using 30 min epoxy to hold the landing gear in. It was the best flight that resulted in my losing the nose block on the long walk back thru the tall grass /WEEDS near San Antonio. I have since built several more and always want to have one ready. Amazing little flyer I always say.
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abl
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« Reply #40 on: March 26, 2017, 04:36:35 PM »

... My Dad, Thee Olde Man, (RIP) always yearned to build one that was lighter than the previous, he built several and I have his latest (in red) which weighs 9 gr. with rubber. Mine (the blue, cruder lazy man's version without the torsion struts) weighs 11 gr without rubber...

 Shocked

So, your Dad's weighs just over half what mine does, and yours weighs about a gram less than what I was hoping for...? Wow. Smiley

Can I ask how you've done that? Is it just wood selection, or did you modify the structure? I used the wood in the kit and - coming back to peanuts after so many years - I really haven't got much of a feel for how light/heavy stuff like leading edges, spars and longerons need to be...
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« Reply #41 on: March 26, 2017, 05:32:50 PM »

My Dad did whack stuff like sanding the tissue. Go from there and do nutty things like that. Also get a balsa stripper and a mic. Have a scale, and weigh everything. I am inspecting his BA-4 to look for clues.
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abl
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« Reply #42 on: April 24, 2017, 01:56:57 PM »

Just a quick epilogue/appendix in case anyone manages to build an Andreason bipe as heavy as this (16+ grams).

Having flown the thing at the Nats and got some timings;
  • A 12" loop of 7/64" FAI rubber flies it for about 30 seconds hand-launch, or about 21 seconds ROG. Lands with some turns left.
  • A 12" loop of 1/8" FAI rubber flies it for about 40 seconds hand-launch, or about 31 seconds ROG. Also lands with some turns left; might think about carving a slightly-finer-pitched prop to use more of the available energy in the motor.
  • After all the effort and weight of adding a moveable rudder, it's ended up at zero deflection! The rudder leading edge is offset to the right about 1/32" for a left turn, and that seems to be enough.
  • Side thrust is about 2.5 degrees, downthrust with 7/64" rubber is very roughly 4 degrees and about 6 or 7 (!) degrees with 1/8 rubber; difficult to be sure because there's loads of downthrust packing and I think the noseblock might be moving a bit when the motor is wound.
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Jack Plane
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« Reply #43 on: April 24, 2017, 04:00:31 PM »

Cheers for this Andy - will be most useful when I get round to making mine.

And congratulations on your sterling performance as a Nats Newbie in both KS and Peanut!

 Grin
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« Reply #44 on: April 24, 2017, 04:23:41 PM »

I didn't make the connection between you here on the forum, and you competing on Sunday ... great performance, particularly in kit scale  Smiley
Lovely model.
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abl
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« Reply #45 on: April 24, 2017, 04:57:55 PM »

Thanks for the very kind words, gents...

Cheers for this Andy - will be most useful when I get round to making mine.
<snip>

Mine's a nice little flyer marred only by a) being a bit heavy (wood selection, I think) and b) some fool moving the rear motor peg to where it's almost impossible to get fingers on - that'll teach me to meddle in the affairs of wizards. I think if you can build yours even a few grams lighter, it'll be much better even if you don't stuff more rubber in. I tried very hard on Sunday to get it to fly higher from a ROG, but it always seemed to land with turns on even with thicker rubber - I think it might be possible to improve on 40 seconds a bit, but at that weight it looks as though the law of diminishing returns is starting to set in.

I didn't make the connection between you here on the forum, and you competing on Sunday.
<snip>

Well, I had to come up with a user name, which I always have problems with, and abl was the first one I tried that wasn't taken... I've added some text to the profile which will have to do for the moment... Smiley
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« Reply #46 on: October 13, 2017, 07:55:08 PM »

I started to build this  a while ago.my plan is only half a page. Ican start it again.
thanks for showing this plane.
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