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Author Topic: Help required with inflating vintage wheels  (Read 1016 times)
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ZK-AUD
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« on: March 20, 2017, 01:36:42 AM »

Hi all - I need the help of the brains trust again.  I have inherited a very nice set of 4" inflatable vintage wheels which I have no doubt the UK contingent will recognize.  They are in really good shape and hold the pressure they have but they need more!  They have what appears to be a soccer ball type valve but I have poked a Trexler pump in there and got nothing and also an air bed pump with soccer ball attachment - nothing doing.  No air gets in or out.  What's the technique anyone?

I have a similar sized set of Trexlers on my Super Scorpion 3 channel RC but some of my dodgy crosswind landings deflate them so I thought these might be an improvement!!
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ZK-AUD
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« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2017, 01:37:34 AM »

Duh!! so here are the pictures!!
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lincoln
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« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2017, 01:40:01 AM »

I guess those must be different than the ones I used to have. As I recall, mine had a little hose that got tucked under the tire after inflation. I also recall seeing pictures of an inflator that looks like a giant syrings.

Of course you could always cheat and ask these guys:
http://www.trexlerballoonwheel.com/
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ZK-AUD
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« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2017, 02:16:02 AM »

Thanks Lincoln but these are not Trexlers.  They will be a British product for certain.  I think they may be 'MS' wheels though there is nothing to identify the manufacturer.  The Brits will be on line in a few hours and someone is bound to know about these.
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billdennis747
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« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2017, 08:21:45 AM »

The Brits will be on line in a few hours and someone is bound to know about these.
Hello Mike. Until the experts arrive...I have one (!) similar wheel. It is clearly-labelled Keil Kraft but I suspect it has a similar origin. When I squeeze it, there is clearly something inside that stops it going flat. Stuffing of some sort. I don't know, but maybe they are not meant to be too hard, to stop the model bouncing.
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ZK-AUD
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« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2017, 12:49:24 PM »

Thanks Bill - I think they need a little more air than they have.  Anyone out there able to shed some light on this for me?
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RalphS
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« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2017, 04:20:46 PM »

I was given a similar pair of air wheels many years ago and have passed them on.  These had black hubs but had the small hole similar to your examples with a projection on the inside.  They either used the old fashioned valve rubber that we all used to carry in our bicycle repair kits over this projection or the projection had a simple flap valve on the end.  The method of inflating was to presumably use the valve stem from a cycle tyre pushed into the hole and pump as normal.  I think the cycle valve type was called a Woods Valve and was replaced by the high pressure valve in the 1950's.

Valve rubber is till available http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VINTAGE-ANTIQUE-BIKE-RESTORERS-MECHANIC-WOODS-VALVE-RUBBER-3-METRE-10-FT-RARE-/391708857332

I seem to remember that my hubs could be unscrewed to allow the tyre to be removed.  Why not take apart and fill with soft foam? 

Ralph
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ZK-AUD
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« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2017, 04:38:27 PM »

Ralph many thanks for these two very useful leads - It sounds as though the flap on the inside of the valve stem may have become adhered so even though the probe is going in the air pressure is not forcing the flap open.  I'll try working some of my Dow Corning rubber grease in there to see if I can coax it open,  or whether it is accessible from the other side if I disassemble the wheel.  If not your other solution is also a good fix.  Cheers, Mike. 
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« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2017, 04:45:54 PM »

Thanks Bill - I think they need a little more air than they have.  Anyone out there able to shed some light on this for me?

I had a pair big air wheels on a Junior 60 when I was a kid, I remember that there was an adapter supplied with them which fitted to an ordinary bike pump. I think that it was made from aluminium and had a thin spigot with a rounded end that was intended to be inserted in the hole on the side of the tyre.

Hope this is of some help
Bert
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ZK-AUD
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« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2017, 12:20:18 AM »

Problem solved.  I split a wheel to have a look at the inside and immediately saw the issue.  The valve is a thick blind tube vulcanized to the inside of the tyre.  It has a hole halfway down its length for air to enter.  This is covered by a thinner rubber sleeve.  Air pressure from the pump displaces the sleeve to let air in and then the sleeve contracts to seal the hole.  The problem is that when you insert your filler probe / nozzle it blocks off the air entry hole on its way down the valve tube.

I hit on the solution which was to use my airbrush held against the outside of the valve aperture.  The fan mouth thingie on the front of the airbrush makes a good seal - game over!  The wheels have never been on a model before and have been kept in the dark all their life so are as new.

Thanks for the help on this guys
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RalphS
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« Reply #10 on: March 21, 2017, 05:46:44 AM »

You will have to make a junior 60 now. Grin
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ZK-AUD
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« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2017, 01:05:09 PM »

Good aeroplane but a little pedestrian when compared with the Super Scorpion.  Mine has a .30 four stroke and 3 channel RC.  Nice flying.
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« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2017, 02:02:01 PM »

Good aeroplane but a little pedestrian when compared with the Super Scorpion.  Mine has a .30 four stroke and 3 channel RC.  Nice flying.

And I was considering a .40 FS for my Sup. Scorp...

I could use a set or two of those wheels...
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« Reply #13 on: March 21, 2017, 02:38:43 PM »

Pit is your Super Scorp built yet?  If not I have a few insights I could share:  The first is power - A .40 2-stroke is way too much for this model.  A .20 2-stroke would be fine or even better the .30 4-stroke.  The Scorp has a huge undercambered wing that generates a lot of lift at slow speeds.  The other thing I could share is that the bottom longerons are sorta parallel but the upper longerons are not, so when you spread the top longerons to the correct plan view it actually imparts a banana shape to the fuselage when viewed from the side which means that you have a heap of unwanted negative incidence on the tail.  This might be OK for free flight but for radio it's not good.  Other people have said to me that their radio Scorps climb like crazy with any kind of power on.  Fortunately I realised the issue in time and modified my tailplane seat to bring the tail back closer to neutral. 

With 3 channel only, and the original amount of dihedral I do struggle with crosswind landings on our rather narrow strip,  but otherwise this is a beautiful big pussycat to fly

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« Reply #14 on: March 22, 2017, 12:24:45 PM »

Haven't started the build yet, other than identifying/recreating parts and printing out the plan.  I obtained the Bodo kit from a friend a number of years ago minus half of the plan (wing and tail-group) and some parts.

I have a never run OS .26FS that I could use, or even go to Amps.  I believe Euro SAM rc-assist events now allow either (assuming I decide to participate).  I also have a full-size Sailplane short kit (Hobby Horn) waiting on the sidelines... (also could use a wheel - gotta keep this on topic Grin).

Funny thing is, I saw wheels at the latest flea-market that were like the ones on this thread - but it didn't "click" (really have to start making a list of what to look for at these events...).
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« Reply #15 on: March 22, 2017, 12:53:49 PM »

The .26 will certainly haul its freight for you but the little 4-strokes are so cheap nowadays.  I use a Chinese ASP .30 which you can get online from Hobby King or whoever and this has proved to be a lovely little engine.  The only issue was the cheap rice grain bearings which eventually crapped out and which I have just swapped out for some nice stainless ones. 
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ZK-AUD
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« Reply #16 on: March 25, 2017, 05:53:55 AM »

Wheels successfully inflated and installed on model.  Spent a pleasant hour this afternoon doing circuits and bumps to test them out.  Great for ironing out divots and sheep turds on the strip
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OZPAF
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« Reply #17 on: March 25, 2017, 07:53:15 PM »

Great fun - hope you missed most of the sheep turds Smiley Nice looking model Mike.
John
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