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Author Topic: Kit Scale 2019 Models  (Read 7493 times)
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danmellor
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« Reply #75 on: August 09, 2018, 07:09:31 PM »

It's my Club's Fun Fly this weekend. The last two such events were blessed with perfect flat calm conditions, so I'm hoping for a repeat this year to give the Moth it's first airing! If anyone fancies a trip to the Cotswolds, the details are probably on the NCMAC site, if not on here...

Cheers,

Dan.
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danmellor
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« Reply #76 on: August 09, 2018, 07:14:02 PM »

It is indeed in the "Event Announcements" section on here!

Dan.
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Mikek
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« Reply #77 on: August 10, 2018, 08:23:20 AM »

Best of luck this weekend, Dan!
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danmellor
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« Reply #78 on: August 10, 2018, 07:12:28 PM »

Thanks, but it's just a flying weekend; no comps! Main aim is to get the Gipsy roughly trimmed before trying it indoors...

Cheers,

Dan.
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DavidJP
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« Reply #79 on: August 11, 2018, 04:53:14 AM »

A bit breezy here (Norfolk) but being further inland you may fare better?  Where do you fly as a matter of interest - Little Rissington used to be nice. 
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danmellor
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« Reply #80 on: August 11, 2018, 05:01:19 AM »

Not too windy here! NCMAC fly on a farm just outside Moreton In Marsh.

Dan.
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Gromit
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« Reply #81 on: September 13, 2018, 05:02:19 PM »

Built from a kit or kit plan. Allowed mods are power source, wheels and moving rubber peg location. Any deviations other than those are penalised; as is a fully painted finish. That's it in a nutshell!

Dan.

Dan

Deviations to improve flight such as increased dihedral, tail area etc as you say would be penalised under kit scale rules but decoration such as paper instrument panels would not be - on my shift anyway.  So if I judge it next year then no penalties for that.  What is difficult for judges is to balance any extra detail against the as per plan requirement in the 'Overall Character' section of the results ie they should not be unduly influenced by the detail if it is not provided on the plan.  This is where some of the kit plans give more scope to impress the judges such as the detailed Comet and Sterling plans versus the simpler keil Kraft etc.  Another interesting scenario is say the reduction of dihedral from the plan to a more realistic amount - should this be penalised although it reduces stability?  Again a balance between the overall appearance compared to the prototype versus loss of character of the kit intent - again down to the view of the judges on the day so we mustn't expect identical scores from different judges.

Doug


« Last Edit: September 13, 2018, 05:26:25 PM by Gromit » Logged

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« Reply #82 on: September 13, 2018, 09:19:08 PM »

Spent all of 5 minutes knocking up some very basic instruments. They do look a lot better than acres of bare wood, though!
 

Oh my goodness!!! You do magnificent work. The cabling from what I see all has connecting fixtures and the gauges are fantastic. I wished I could handle Interlaced Cabling like you do. If you don't mind I would like to save that picture with your name on it and date. With your permission, I would like to make a 24" x 36" picture of it and hang it on my workshop wall for inspiration!! I'll wait for your contact.

Thank you.
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #83 on: September 16, 2018, 11:08:16 AM »

Not sure what state my Eindecker will be in after the outdoor season finishes, and until I get it to the Velodrome I won't know how well it goes indoors. Therefore, I'm casting around for another Kit Scale project so as to have a spare model ready for the 2019 indoor nats. I'm fast inclining towards this 150% version of the KK Chipmunk, originally kitted by Replikit and so now available from VMC.

150% gets the model to a useful 27" span. What really appeals to me though is the possiblity of doing this scarlet version, which was the aircraft Prince Charles learned to fly on, and did his first solo. There's an article on the aircraft in a recent edition of Flypast. I'm thinking nice easy tissue finish and a little jug-eared caricature pilot complete with royal crown.

Question is, can I get decent tissue in that red/orange colour? I don't think it's an Esaki shade. Also, how much of a points hit will I suffer by adding the little beacon on the canopy, I wonder? Never mind, I think this one needs doing!
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Re: Kit Scale 2019 Models
Re: Kit Scale 2019 Models
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #84 on: September 16, 2018, 12:06:10 PM »

Dan's just messaged me to say that the Replikit 150% Chippie is actually an enlarged Veron Chipmunk, not the KK one as (mis)stated on the VMC site. Thanks for the warning, Dan. A pity though, as in my opinion the KK version is a better looking model. I don't like the way the wings meet to make a point under the fus. on the Veron one. I'm just going by pictures I've found on Google.

There is still the Dumas 30" option if I want to go even larger I suppose.
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Squirrelnet
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« Reply #85 on: September 16, 2018, 01:48:27 PM »

This one sounds great Pete, particularly the Prince Charles pilot, but will we have to bow or courtesy as it flies past ?
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Indoorflyer
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« Reply #86 on: September 16, 2018, 01:50:46 PM »

Hi Pete.  Would the Aerographics/Richard Preston Chipmunk fit your mission?
Also Frog produced a Chippie in the deluxe scale series.

(Downloads available on AeroFred and House of Frog, respectively)
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Jack Plane
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« Reply #87 on: September 16, 2018, 02:18:39 PM »

This one sounds great Pete, particularly the Prince Charles pilot, but will we have to bow or courtesy as it flies past ?

No, just hold up a photograph of some contemporary architecture and wait for the spin!   Grin

(Only joking!)
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Jack Plane
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« Reply #88 on: September 16, 2018, 02:33:15 PM »


Hi Pete.  Would the Aerographics/Richard Preston Chipmunk fit your mission?
Also Frog produced a Chippie in the deluxe scale series.


The Aerographics version looks more authentic (John Bowerman entered a lovely one in this year's Nats which scored very high on static), but the KK one is both elegant in itself and convincing enough in its looks (this is KS so total accuracy doesn't matter) and is surely lighter than the Preston one at any given wingspan.  I built the KK one at the original 20" span, which is a very stable flier.  Jon Whitmore entered a very good Frog version a few years ago which was a top-job on static and flew very well.
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DHnut
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« Reply #89 on: September 16, 2018, 02:43:26 PM »

Pete,
        Have you considered dyeing tissue as that surely will be legal. We allow the use of ink or dye for colour with our kit scale and it is very light. This surely no different to using wrapping tissue that is available in a very wide range of colours even if it is a pig to cover with and not durable. I have stripped the wing of the Comper for repair and also repair to the Cub. Peterborough was a bit rough on models.
Ricky
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #90 on: September 16, 2018, 02:58:10 PM »

Thanks all. Yes, Jon, all the models you've just mentioned are lovely. I've always liked the KK version best of all because to me it captures the essence of the aircraft really well in just a few elegantly placed sticks. Some kits just do this, and others fall slightly short. The Frog, KK and Aerographics are all around 20 or 21 inches which is okay, but ideally I'd like to build 24-27". Still, beggars can't be choosers. I might just go with the Keil Kraft I think. At least it'll go nicely in smaller halls and I've still got the plan and printwood that Andrew D kindly gave me ages ago.

After a little googling and picture-pilfering, here are Jon Whitmore's Frog version and your KK one side by side for comaprison. Beauties both!
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Re: Kit Scale 2019 Models
« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 03:29:36 PM by Pete Fardell » Logged
DavidJP
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« Reply #91 on: September 17, 2018, 03:42:50 AM »

Can't you enlarge the KK plan and go from there?  IOt does not have to be built from a kit does it - merely the lan?
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #92 on: September 17, 2018, 04:38:41 AM »

Can't you enlarge the KK plan and go from there?  It does not have to be built from a kit does it - merely the plan?

No, you can't enlarge the kit plan under indoor KS rules, David. The Replikit 150% Veron plan would be okay, but that's only because Replikit actually produced a kit in that enlarged size.
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VMC
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« Reply #93 on: September 17, 2018, 07:01:38 AM »

Hello all

Just to clear this up, the Replikit 150% scale Chipmunk is an upscaled version of the Veron Tru-Flite kit NOT the KK small flying scale version.

Our website had the kit incorrectly labelled as KK - sorry about that.

I have just corrected this.

For those of you that prefer the KK version, it would be reasonably easy for us to upscale that one too if there was sufficient demand.

Hadi@VMC
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #94 on: September 17, 2018, 08:03:38 AM »

Thanks for the clarification, Hadi. I for one would be very interested in a 150 KK Chipmunk kit.
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SP250
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« Reply #95 on: September 17, 2018, 09:44:17 AM »

Pete

Seems a bit of a sneaky way around the rulebook to get a manufacturer to up-scale the KK kit so it is eligible for BMFA competition....
Replikit as far as I recall, only made short kits and not a full kit, but I could be mistaken.
I have some "Physics of Flight" short kits - who made cnc copies of various KK (and other) kits but just supplied the plan to the original size.

Bears asking the STC to agree eligibility before anyone goes to any trouble or spends any money.

John M
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Jack Plane
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« Reply #96 on: September 17, 2018, 10:13:17 AM »

An interesting conundrum John, made more interesting by the fact that previously everyone thought the VMC/Replikit 150% version was the KK one!  Personally I'd have no objection, but I'm just a player rather than a committee member.

One question:  surely a 50% enlargement of the 20" original would make the wingspan 30"?  A span of 27" would denote an original of 18", or is there some other calculation at play?

For what its worth, my KK Chippie felt more comfortable outdoors than in, but it was my first flying model for nearly four decades and although not heavy wasn't particularly light either (35g AUW inc rubber, 0.65g/sq in) and I didn't yet have the experience or any large enough venue to risk it indoors!  Here it is nicely enough trimmed (except at the very end!) in plenty of outdoor space, all times consistently very close to 30 secs (on a 2x loop of 3/16" with 1000 turns) each flight... making it ideal for Outdoor KS!  https://photos.app.goo.gl/3aEj12PAKXLctt7k9
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #97 on: September 17, 2018, 10:31:52 AM »

John, rest assured I'm not trying to sneak around the rules! It's been discussed before, and on balance I wouldn't enter a new 'short kit' (that is one which never existed as a full kit) in KS. There are plenty of established kits and kit plans to choose from without giving myself that potential extra hassle. However, I believe the Replikit/VMC 150% kits are not short kits by any definition. They come in a box with everything provided and laser cut parts don't they? They're therefore simply 'kits' and so surely eligible.
Also, why shouldn't manufacturers produce genuine new, up-scaled, laser cut versions of old kits to satisfy a demand for Kit Scale entry? Surely if that happens then it simply means a company like VMC thrives and Kit Scale, yet again, contributes positively to the continued revival of our hobby?

That said, for a quiet life I'll probably just do a normal sized KK Chippie now.

(And sorry, Dan- I really didn't mean to steer your fine thread into controversial waters; I just wanted to build a Chipmunk, and was wondering which one!)
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Yak 52
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« Reply #98 on: September 17, 2018, 10:45:19 AM »

my KK Chippie felt more comfortable outdoors than in...

Dave Crompton flew the KK Chippie against my FROG one in 2013. I seem to remember he brought two  Cheesy

Some pilfered video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5u1u5hDx3U
 Smiley
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Jack Plane
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« Reply #99 on: September 17, 2018, 11:01:24 AM »


Dave Crompton flew the KK Chippie against my FROG one in 2013. I seem to remember he brought two  Cheesy

Some pilfered video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5u1u5hDx3U
 Smiley

Top pilfering Jon!

This virtual Chipfest makes me want to build another one!

Mmmm now...? I wonder which of my CO2 motors would be best..?  Cheesy
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