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Author Topic: Waco SRE  (Read 1628 times)
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DavidJP
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« on: August 08, 2018, 01:21:43 PM »

This from the Stahl plan - so far about 9gms.
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Waco SRE
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dputt7
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« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2018, 04:35:29 AM »

  Neat, to fiddly for me though. Alright I'll bite, what's with the rib in the port top wing  Huh
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DavidJP
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« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2018, 06:31:14 AM »

Nothing to do with Adam and Eve - just remind me to double up on the ribs there to slide the struts into
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Snaky Stringer
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« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2018, 12:15:57 PM »

It looks very pretty. Scaled down I presume.
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Crabby
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« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2018, 02:20:41 PM »

Wow. That’s light. Are you a picky balsa chooser?
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« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2018, 07:57:44 PM »

Have you trained some pet termites David? Is this nice looking little model a Pnut?

John
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DavidJP
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« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2018, 05:53:44 AM »

No it is not scaled down - it is Mr Stahl's Peanut version.  I have built his larger version as well which flies very well but is a little large for indoor.

Light Crabby?Huh? You made me feel very depressed at the announcement you hoped to have your Triplane at 10gms but I gather it is now nearing 15.  Actually it may be slightly more, a gramme or so because I have added the spats.  I admit I have tried to be picky with the balsa because Graham Banham I think it was told me a while ago that one has to be obsessive about saving weight. I do do "obsessive" on occasions  (my attacks on our society for example) so maybe it is paying dividends. But no worries, covering painting and a few scale features will soon have it in the high double or low triple figures!

Back in the 50's I remember reading an article about space travel and one "boffin" claimed it would never happen because the amount of fuel required to power the "ship" out of gravitational pull would be too heavy for the rocket motor and making the motor the bigger the more fuel.  Well...... we know know differently and so hope for me yet!

Thank you though for your compliments.  Were you by the way in awe of the engine?  Hours of work there.
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Snaky Stringer
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« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2018, 08:31:36 AM »

I didn't know Earl Stahl had done a peanut version. Is it available on line?
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DavidJP
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« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2018, 03:09:49 PM »

 Neither does anyone else!  I got confused - the Peanut version I am doing is by Walt Mooney! Sorry.  Comes with the pension book! 

I have added some bits - I can’t completely compromise on scale models where I feel it will be obvious so I added some stringers along the fuselage sides as they were not completely flat.  The plan I found on Outerzone - I was just browsing for Peanut plans and had selected the Fairey Fantome;  then noticed the Waco, and having built the larger version by Stahl which flys well grabbed the Peanut as well.  The Fantome could be next as the indoor season comets!
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Snaky Stringer
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« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2018, 07:14:05 PM »

I do think that the Stahl version scaled down would be a nice peanut. It might need a bit of editing. I still have bits of mine (Stahl) that I built maybe twenty years ago or more. It didn't fly well but that was my fault Im sure. I also had a little all sheet 15 inch version, Wee Waco by Ken Willard, I think, and that flew well. I think it's in the plan gallery. I also have a half finished Mooney one waiting for the right moment. Yours looks very promising.
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DavidJP
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« Reply #10 on: August 11, 2018, 05:12:31 AM »

Thank you - my Stahl Waco flew almost off the board - much to my surprise and onlookers commented it showed much promise.  I then fiddled with things and it went off the boil somewhat so am now retrying more sophisticated fiddling! Gurney flap and all that!  Improving but I am not a dedicated trimmer. To easily distracted by what others are doing!  Always more interesting!
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Snaky Stringer
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« Reply #11 on: August 11, 2018, 05:53:00 AM »

Butch Hadland had a very nice Stahl Waco in white tissue with red decoration and he told me he had had trouble getting it to fly at first. Plenty of nose weight was his main solution, as far as I remember, but of course he was a superb builder and knew a lot about trimming, too.
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Crabby
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« Reply #12 on: August 11, 2018, 09:50:32 AM »

Hi Snaky, here is thee Olde Man's Mooney SRE if it helps any. Notice the huge amount of downthrust and the major globs of clay on the prop and the cowling. He and Butch Hadland flew their SREs together a lot. They were great pals, often in fits of hysterics. Thee Olde Man's abstract sense of humor combined with Hadland's keen British articulation was a highly combustible combination resulting in fits of obscene laughter.
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DavidJP
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« Reply #13 on: August 11, 2018, 01:05:14 PM »

I vaguely remember BH Crabby - where did your Father meet up with him?  May even have met him if it was England. Son is now well into Dads footsteps.
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DHnut
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« Reply #14 on: August 11, 2018, 04:11:42 PM »

I was at Brize Norton with Butch in the early days of Peanut about 1971 and indoor scale and can attest to an earthy style but a very generous person in helping others. WE were both on the RAFMAA committee and that included the long hike from Brize to Leconfield for meetings as the chairman was the Station Commander.  The quality of build was always impressive. He had a SIG monocoupe that did not fly, until it hit a wall and the CO2 tank moved forward after which it flew well.
  Mike was a very young lad then.
Ricky
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Snaky Stringer
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« Reply #15 on: August 11, 2018, 06:38:23 PM »

Crabby, that Mooney SRE built by your esteemed parent is very elegant in spite of the glob of goo under the cowl. Surely a nice metal washer concealed in the dummy motor would be prettier? That's a nice colour scheme, too. There was a nice series of photos in Aeroplane Monthly a good few years ago of a very handsome yellow and dark blue model E. I must have it somewhere, but haven't seen it recently. My filing system is not good. I think the photos were by Harold Levy. I must search. Seek and ye shall find and all that.
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Crabby
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« Reply #16 on: August 11, 2018, 08:37:44 PM »

What do you think of his flying surfaces set up? I don't understand his extreme wing incidence in conjunction with the clay and downthrust. It looks like he went for the full 3 degrees in the wings.
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LASTWOODSMAN
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« Reply #17 on: August 12, 2018, 12:25:52 AM »

Is there also positive incidence on the stabilizer too?   Three degrees there also ?

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Richard
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Snaky Stringer
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« Reply #18 on: August 12, 2018, 04:24:23 AM »

As I was preparing my breakfast it came to me in a flash that the photographer was Howard Levy, not Harold, which is why I found nothing about him last night.

https://airandspace.si.edu/stories/editorial/howard-levy-photography-collection
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OZPAF
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« Reply #19 on: August 12, 2018, 06:04:00 AM »

A quick check of the SRE pic appears to indicate relative to the tail ie tail at 0 deg

Bottom of top wing 3 deg (chord line would be around 3 deg higher)

Bottom wing (bottom again) approx. 2 deg

Thrustline - 5deg.

With say a Cg around 30% of the AC of the combined wings, then I can see the need for all the clay when you consider the position of the rear rubber anchor - a good reason to move the peg forward. I think I would have put it just behind the lower wing TE.

The model geometry probably  could not handle moving the CG further aft than say 30%  for stability, while retaining a close to scale tail size. Thus this leads to the fairly high incidence angles of the wing and tail to achieve a decent glide

The 5 deg down thrust would go quite close to passing through the CG(which would also likely be  close to the drag centre) reducing thrust trim problems.

My thoughts anyway Crabby. I bet it flew well.

John
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Crabby
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« Reply #20 on: August 12, 2018, 07:07:46 AM »

David, yesterday was a rough day for me. First I messed up abl's thread with clutter un-related to his SRE posting, then I related this un-solicited information to Snaky Stringer, instead of you, the rightful author of this posting. My wife goy me out on errands just in time before I got into more shenanigans. Thanks to John for dissecting my dads trimming on his SRE, and I hope after all, this info is of some value to you! back your regular scheduled program!
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DavidJP
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« Reply #21 on: September 21, 2018, 09:12:36 AM »

Finally ready for flight - I hope.  

Not disclosing weight but sans rubber but at the moment balancing as per plan (with a dummy motor) it is nearer to 20g than 10!!  

Isn't it amazing (and very useful) that a photo will show up blemishes and imperfections  that one does not notice in the flesh??  

As my second Peanut still a bit of a learning curve.  I find them fun and challenging and frustrating on occasions. But think I have cracked the frustration bit.  All very well for these boffins to build one weighing 7.9gms etc. fully painted and decorated that do 4mins with ease,  but they only fly it once or twice a year.  Otherwise it is cocooned in a box. I want to fly it as and when the mood takes so sturdiness is essential as walls move and also particularly as I do not always concentrate enough when handling my peanuts.  But that will come with practice. I hope.
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MKelly
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« Reply #22 on: September 21, 2018, 10:20:37 AM »

That looks very nice!  I've had so much fun with my Stahl Waco that it's made me want to build a peanut one.  Too many things I want to build, not enough time...

Hope she flies well for you. 

Mike
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DavidJP
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« Reply #23 on: September 21, 2018, 11:32:25 AM »

Thank you Mike - trouble is like when you wall paper a room all you see are the blemishes....

Mr Mooney omitted some stringers etc on the fuselage which I could not live with and had to include but otherwise his plan seems reasonably truthful.  Not done any real measuring though.
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LASTWOODSMAN
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« Reply #24 on: September 21, 2018, 12:06:11 PM »

Hi David!  Your little peanut Waco SRE sure does look sturdy.   Shocked   I assume you are flying with Landing Gear down.  Huh  Good luck on your test glides - hope you have some good long grass or high weeds at your field - what is your field like?   It is a sweet looking model.   Glad you are not "cocooning it in a box".     Grin   LOL   
     The more you fly it, the more you will like it.   And of course the more beaten up it gets - but that is where the real fun is.    "Flying it as and when the mood takes"  - that works for me too.    Sometimes it is more fun when you don't try for a world's record, and just have a blast with a lot of shorter flights, and with a little bit of wind,  there is your excitement for the day, and a great stress reliever ...

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard
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