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Author Topic: VMC Spitfire Night Fighter  (Read 1607 times)
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #25 on: February 05, 2019, 04:27:56 PM »

Looks great! Just a week's work too!
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DavidJP
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« Reply #26 on: February 06, 2019, 05:19:51 AM »

Flippin ‘eck..... all a bit nice!  Tee hee ....... now let’s see what you are like at covering.  And don’t say you covered Wellingtons during the War .... won’t believe you!
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avrovulcan
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« Reply #27 on: February 12, 2019, 03:05:53 PM »

Thank you for your comments. It is good encouragement!  Cheesy

Well, I have had a go at covering (The only wellington's I've covered, are boots in mud!)

I found putting the tissue on wasn't too bad, especially with the excellent instructions. It was doping the tissue where I had a few problems.

I covered the tail plane and rudder first - start small!

I used the glue stick method as recommended, but was unsure how best to use the eze dope. The instructions on the bottle said to wet the tissue first with 5% solution then attach to the framework. The instructions with the model said to use 5% solution to shrink the tissue but I wasn't sure when to use it.

I didn't know how best to proceed, so I followed the bottle instructions - that was a mistake! The covering dried very quickly and it was a struggle to trim the edges of the tissue, ready for sticking the edges down with PVA. Eventually I managed it and the rudder and tail plane actually looked really good. When completely dried, I followed both instructions and brushed on 30% eze dope solution and set on spacers to dry overnight.

I was devastated when I came back to it in the morning and found the tissue had sagged and stuck together between the ribs.  Sad  I took a deep breath, stripped the tissue off, cleaned up the frames and tried again (hoping there was plenty of the covering to allow for the odd mistake). This time I put the tissue on dry, it was a lot easier to trim and stick the edges this time, as the covering hadn't shrunk around the frame. Then sprayed the 5% eze dope on the tissue - much better. Now I was back at the stage I had reached previously - ready for the 30% solution.

Having experienced the sagging previously, I opted for spraying the solution on to try minimise the sagging.  It worked! So I continued to build up the doping by light spraying instead of brushing. Brilliant!  Smiley once dried, they looked perfect.

So on to the wings and fuselage. Following the same process, the wings went well until the bottom tissue covering of one wing sagged after the 30% doping and stuck to the corkboard - aarrgh! I didn't want to strip the whole wing, so I put a small patch over the hole and instead of the spacers being 1 high, I made them 3 high so if the wing covering did sag, it wouldn't touch the cork again. Yay, It worked!

The fuselage went well and had no problems with that. Now everything is covered and doped and a few lessons learned along the way. Phew!

The only thing I don't like about the eze dope is the marks it leaves behind. Not sure what I can do about that.  Undecided

All bits and pieces are made, shaped and painted. Now all I have to do is assemble it all.  Shocked
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Re: VMC Spitfire Night Fighter
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TheLurker
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« Reply #28 on: February 12, 2019, 04:15:11 PM »

Quote from: avrovulcan
...the wings went well until the bottom tissue covering of one wing sagged after the 30% doping and stuck to the corkboard - aarrgh!
You are not the first, you will not be the last.  DAHIKT. Smiley

Nice wrinkle free finish on that lot.

There are quite a few threads/posts regarding Eze Dope (which I still maintain is a damn silly name) and how to get the best out of it on the forum.  Have a nose around using the search.
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Jack Plane
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« Reply #29 on: February 13, 2019, 02:25:40 AM »

Well done!  Will look dead good once the decals are on and its all together.

I've not used EzeDope so can't advise on it.  I use traditional non-shrinking dope thinned 50/50 (heating on, windows open, work fast, then leave the room for ten minutes).  There's a good tutorial here (Mike uses the dope method to apply the tissue, whereas I use the glue-stick and PVA method): http://www.ffscale.co.uk/comp7.htm

Being the night-fighter version, at least you won't have to do control-surface outlines!  Cheesy
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avrovulcan
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« Reply #30 on: February 13, 2019, 03:15:15 PM »


There are quite a few threads/posts regarding Eze Dope (which I still maintain is a damn silly name) and how to get the best out of it on the forum.  Have a nose around using the search.

Thanks, I'll have a look.

Well done!  Will look dead good once the decals are on and its all together.

I've not used EzeDope so can't advise on it.  I use traditional non-shrinking dope thinned 50/50 (heating on, windows open, work fast, then leave the room for ten minutes).  There's a good tutorial here (Mike uses the dope method to apply the tissue, whereas I use the glue-stick and PVA method): http://www.ffscale.co.uk/comp7.htm

Being the night-fighter version, at least you won't have to do control-surface outlines!  Cheesy

Thanks for the link. I'm really pleased with how my first attempt turned out. Looking forward to seeing it all together and looking like a Spit instead of a pile of pieces!


I've stuck the wings, tail plane and rudder onto the fuselage, but I have found a slight problem. The left wingtip it slightly higher than the right. How do I bring it down a bit so it matches the right? I did wonder if I should dope it again and with a support the right height under the wing, put a weight on top? The only thing with that is if the wing warps and I end up making the wing in worse shape.

Suggestions and experience appreciated.
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abl
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« Reply #31 on: February 13, 2019, 04:14:58 PM »

Um.

That looks as though the centre section alignment is OK but one of the wings has the wrong dihedral; if that's the case, you could try running a razor saw or knife between the joined centre section and wing ribs, prizing them apart, filling it with a balsa shim and then adding a small dihedral brace (to join the top mainspar) from something like 1/64" ply. Nobody will know after you've patched it with a bit of black tissue.
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billdennis747
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« Reply #32 on: February 13, 2019, 04:25:57 PM »

If you remove the money, is it noticeable?
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ZK-AUD
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« Reply #33 on: February 13, 2019, 05:37:14 PM »

Do nothing.  Pretend you didn't see it.  If anything it should help flatten out your left turn
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applehoney
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« Reply #34 on: February 13, 2019, 07:08:09 PM »

Put another couple of coins under that tip, everything will look fine and you can continue with a clear conscience .........     Grin
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flydean1
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« Reply #35 on: February 13, 2019, 10:19:00 PM »

Do NOTHING!  It looks fine, and will fly quite well just like it is.  From the ground circling overhead it won't be noticed.
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #36 on: February 14, 2019, 01:51:06 AM »

Swap a couple of the 2ps for four 1ps. Then the towers will both reach to the wings and you’ll have the same value under each tip!
Seriously though, it’s close enough to my eyes.
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OZPAF
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« Reply #37 on: February 14, 2019, 02:57:33 AM »

Another vote for leaving it as it is. It effectively gives the model a slight bit of tail tilt for a left turn.

John
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Jack Plane
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« Reply #38 on: February 14, 2019, 03:10:01 AM »

The quickest solution would be to just turn the lights off - its a night fighter after all!  Grin

With apologies Caroline, welcome to the wonderful world of mithering about lots of little things...  Smiley

Jon
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abl
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« Reply #39 on: February 14, 2019, 04:15:53 AM »

Having thought about it at length, I withdraw my complicated advice and refer you to what everyone else has said; I particularly liked Pete's idea about balancing the value of the coins on both sides, shows good fiscal probity.  Smiley
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avrovulcan
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« Reply #40 on: February 14, 2019, 04:55:58 AM »

Thanks for all the advice, I will do nothing!  Cheesy

It is not too noticeable if the coins are taken away and probably even less so when the undercarriage is fitted.

Pete's comment made me chuckle, the coins are actually tokens from my husband's Pachislo slot machine so they have no values!

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DavidJP
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« Reply #41 on: February 14, 2019, 05:05:39 AM »

Eze dope - it seems people either love it or loathe it - I come in the latter.  Possibly a generation thing - been using conventional dope for almost seventy years and am addicted.  But with conventional dope thinning is the main factor - thin it as you feel right and the add more thinners. 

As to the "warp" - yes pretend it is not there. Flying will dictate what to do. That is why full size aeroplanes have trim tabs. 

Oh and your covering -  hmmmm shall we say "pretty damn good old girl"?
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avrovulcan
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« Reply #42 on: February 14, 2019, 05:23:21 AM »

DavidJP, I'm not sure what to make of the ezedope at the moment. The last stick and paper model I made was 30 years ago, when I was in my teens, and that was the first and last as I couldn't get on with the doping!

At least this time it actually looks like a plane! I'm quite pleased with my first(ish) model.  Cheesy
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DavidJP
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« Reply #43 on: February 14, 2019, 06:24:48 AM »

And you have every right to be pleased M'dear,  young lady, particularly so as a "firstish" model. May I ask what next?  If you are sticking with VMC then the triplane seems a good one if you like that kind of thing.
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avrovulcan
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« Reply #44 on: February 14, 2019, 06:27:34 AM »

I'm not sure what to do next. I was wondering about something suitable from the plans library. I like a challenge and making things from scratch.
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Rhys
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« Reply #45 on: February 14, 2019, 10:58:11 PM »

Ahhh... that's the reason I could never get my dihedral on the mark. I never was fortunate to have the necessary coinage under each wingtip  Grin

Rhys
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Graham Banham
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« Reply #46 on: February 15, 2019, 02:03:21 AM »

I tried eze dope once then binned it: rubbish! Seems to me this has been borne out in part by the fact that even those who use it describe thinning ratios and the like as being critical, and it seems to have any number of finish problems after use. I still only use banana oil with all sorts of thinning percentages and have never had any problems.

Nice model: leave the wings alone!
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Andrew Darby
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« Reply #47 on: February 15, 2019, 02:20:55 AM »

I agree with all on the wings, I never compare them like you did, and it’s highly likely that lots of my models have been the same!  Grin

Eze dope....  The name isn’t really correct.  It’s really not so ezedope.  I spent quite some time experimenting with it.  In the correct proportions it works fine, BUT to avoid the problem that you saw you MUST brush it out.  Any pools or remaining streaks of it will dry white.  Other than the advantages of the lack of smell one thing it does do is completely seal the tissue, which means that it won’t go saggy in humid/damp conditions which it can with dope and especially banana oil...

Like Graham I use banana oil on my models, it’s easy to apply and it smells like pear drops!

Andrew
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« Reply #48 on: February 15, 2019, 04:23:51 AM »

Andrew - did you try spraying EzeDope?

A.
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DavidJP
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« Reply #49 on: February 15, 2019, 06:04:31 AM »

I'm not sure what to do next. I was wondering about something suitable from the plans library. I like a challenge and making things from scratch.

Yes- I am a scratch builder by habit..... but todays kits are very good value.  I take it you know ab out Outerzone and Aerofred for free plans as well - down load the pd. and you can either get it copied locally or, as many do now, use some software to print it off in sections and stick it together.  But beware - you will be spoilt for choice.  You might just be ready or the Howard Boys Lysander?

https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=1857
 Cool Wink   
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