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Outdoor Free Flight Forum => Power => Topic started by: Yak 52 on July 08, 2013, 08:12:06 AM



Title: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on July 08, 2013, 08:12:06 AM
I've been considering trying a diesel FF model for next summer but I'm a total diesel novice. I'd like to do a small scale model or possibly something for the Bowden trophy.

For the Bowden I was thinking of building the Model Shop Newcastle Wasp (42" Biplane) The plan says engines up to 1cc but I've been advised a Mills 1.3 would suit it. For scale I would go for something a little smaller, around 30-36" span (no specific subject in mind yet.)

I've been reading and gathering info from clubmates but I'd welcome recommendations on how to proceed. Where's best to purchase (ebay seems pricey at the moment?) and what engines would suit a beginner?

I have a little experience with small glow engines but none with diesels.

Cheers,
Jon


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: billdennis747 on July 08, 2013, 08:23:05 AM
Jon
I don't know anything about the Wasp but  Mills 1.3 sounds too much for a 42" model. I've got one in a 52" scale model.
Here's my opinion. There is only one choice for scale - an original Mills .75. Not Indian, not Boddo, nothing else. There are dozens of designs of suitable size, or that can be enlarged/reduced.
I have sent you a PM
Bill


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on July 08, 2013, 08:37:53 AM
Thanks Bill, what sort of size model would you be looking at for a .75? I know the answer will be "it depends on the subject" but as a rough guide? Or any examples?

Thanks
Jon


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: billdennis747 on July 08, 2013, 09:04:58 AM
I am currently flying .75 in Avro 504 36", Be2e 41" , Strutter 38" SE5a 30". The first and last are overpowered. It's down to wing area and weight. I have flown monoplanes (Puss and hawk Moth) at 44". Weight should be 16 - 20oz max. The thing about the Mills is that you can easily slow it down if overpowered.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on July 08, 2013, 11:05:04 AM
Thanks Bill. So I may get away with a .75 in a MS Wasp if I build light enough..?

What sort of prop diameter would I be looking at?


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: billdennis747 on July 08, 2013, 11:30:31 AM
I'm sorry, I have no idea what a MS Wasp looks like but if the plan says up to 1cc it will be ok if light and will fly beautifully in nice weather.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: billdennis747 on July 08, 2013, 01:58:10 PM
Sorry Yak, I missed your last question. A Mills develops max power on a 7 x 4 but sounds a bit hectic. For scale an 8 x 4 is the norm.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on July 08, 2013, 04:28:22 PM
Thanks again Bill. The MS Wasp is not that well known but I believe one won the Bowden a few years back. It's fairly a conventional semi-scale model. For the Bowden rules I could scale the plan (I think).

I really do prefer small for a scale model since that's what I've mostly built until now. But are smaller engines any harder to start?


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: billdennis747 on July 08, 2013, 04:32:59 PM
The Mills 75 and 1.3 are the easiest engines in the world to start. Unlike modern engines you can feel what they are telling you. If it doesn't start quickly, you've got something wrong. Only if a Mills does not fit a cowling would I build a scale model without one. Again I refer only to the genuine article.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: gossie on July 08, 2013, 05:45:04 PM
DC Spitfires 1cc and Sabres 1.5 are an okay sport type engine and are all over the place for sale.

A Luton Minor from Aeromodeller......the 44in span one is a nice model and flier.   I built one in 1962 for a Webra Piccolo radial mount engine.   Still have it, and it's won and placed a few times.
 G-AMAW is my one, but in the old copper colour fuselage with silver wings.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Ployd on July 08, 2013, 10:18:45 PM
Jon, for a light model say 30 to 36" span a good 0.5cc PAW would provide all the power you need or you could consider the MP Jet 0.6 Classic (not the 1cc BB version). Yes, a good second hand Mills 75 is more than acceptable if it comes at the right price.

As for starting abilities, I would rank the MP Jet Classic equal to the Mills with the PAW requiring a little more skill and patience (have used all three) but once mastered the PAW 0.5 will happily handle most models up to 44" span. I use a PAW 1cc in a 36" span Dizzy Diesel and a PAW 80 in a PAAgeboy. If you do not want to buy a new engine and keep to a budget consider a second hand 0.75 DC Merlin.

Ployd in OZ


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: dputt7 on July 08, 2013, 11:59:14 PM
Jon
If you can afford a new engine then I would consider the .6 cc MP Jet the ideal engine,(there's nothing like a new diesel) I have used them in models from 36" to 44" span and to me have all the benefits and easy starting of the .75 Mills  They will swing an 8X4 but happier with a 7X4, here's a photo of my 36" span Longster Wimpy built from Walt Mooney plans that flies happily on 3/4 throttle. Apart from the Mills .75 my second hand engine choice for a small model (36") would be  a .5 DC Dart though the chances of finding a good one might be difficult. My best advice is whatever you buy make sure you learn how to start it easily and that it will run at a constant speed before you start to build your model, nothing puts you off  more than being out in the middle of the field trying to start a cranky motor.  I fly all sorts of models, Gliders, Rubber, Electric and diesel powered (mostly Scale) and there is nothing like watching a nicely trimmed diesel powered scale model circling above. Good Luck with your choice
regards Dave


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: billdennis747 on July 09, 2013, 01:44:01 AM
I too have heard good things about the MP Jet but have never handled one. Check size and weight.
For scale, rear induction is much more convenient.
Need to be aware that the PAW 0.5 is more powerful by far than a Mills 75. Ray Hall flew a 52" Chrislea Ace with one!


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: PeeTee on July 09, 2013, 03:12:38 AM
Jon

I have an MP Jet which is probably the easiest starting diesel I've owned (from AE 0.5 up to AM35 & PAW 19), but there again I've never owned a Mills.

As for the PAW 0.5, a flying chum has a number of these he uses in FF mini vintage duration and I normally time for him. As Bill says, they are very powerful for the capacity, but not reknowned for ease of starting. If the fits & fittings are there, not a bad starter (but nowhere near the ease of a Mills or MP Jet), but in many cases, four letter expletive inducing ::)

Peter


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Laurence Marks on July 09, 2013, 03:31:27 AM
Can't agree on the PAW 55 and the difficulty of starting..  inverted a pig but upright or sidewinder, no problems.  Thats my experience anyway.  In fact a few years ago I'd have been much better off at the Nats if it had refused to start.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: billdennis747 on July 09, 2013, 03:41:02 AM
Just to be clear, I have not said that a PAW 55 is difficult to start, although it does not compare to a Mills. But as I did say, I find that modern engines give me no 'feel'. You can be flicking away with no response and then suddenly it is roaring away. Another factor is that the Mills does not care much where the fuel head is.
My views are from the perspective of possibly flying in a competition where I want quick starts. I have no interest in engines per se; they just need to do the job.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on July 09, 2013, 05:56:30 AM
Thanks chaps. The MP Jet has been recommended to me before, but I'm not sure if they are available at the moment (couldn't get hold of Flitehook by phone).

The little MP Jet 040 appeals - smaller again. And when you see what people are paying for Mills' on ebay, a new MP looks very appealing  :o


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Greg Langelius on July 09, 2013, 07:45:12 AM
http://www.palmodelproducts.com/engines.html  .049 CI = .8 CC


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Ployd on July 09, 2013, 09:19:38 AM
If the fits are good a PAW 55 will start quite easily inverted once you have sorted out the starting procedure before hand i.e. get to know your engine before you bolt it into a model.

I used an inverted PAW 55 installation in my Piper Cub and made an elbow feed connected to the needle valve.

For MP Jet Classic availability check with Dave Owen (see http://www.pelaero.com.au home page for PDF price list).

Ployd in OZ


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on July 13, 2013, 01:50:03 PM
I took some photos of Geoff Stubbs' MS Wasp this afternoon. Geoff has an ED Bee in his. He originally tried it with an AE 1cc but it was a bit hot "looping and rolling off the top". He thought a Mills 0.75 might cope but the MP jet .060 would be underpowered.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on October 15, 2013, 12:41:29 PM
I've just come across this engine as part of a garage clearance. It's labelled as a K19. I couldn't find anything much about it or even what cc it is. I was wondering if it was worth bothering with. I think it may have been used for RC? Is it worth owt? ... and will it ever run again?  :-\

Cheers
Jon


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: danmellor on October 15, 2013, 02:54:58 PM
Looks like a Kingcat 1.5. A British engine from the late '70s or early '80s. The Kingcat Deluxe came with a rather snazzy set of exhaust pipes, hence the exhaust fitting. I've no experience of them, but they had a reasonable reputation at the time.

As for other diesels, I agree with Bill; Mills all the way! I've never owned a genuine Mills but the three Indian Mills I've had have all been good, even though they had a reputation for-ahem-variable quality...

Good luck with it,

Dan.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: DavidJP on October 15, 2013, 03:00:43 PM
Not sure the Wasp would be best for Bowden - the Tomboy seems to do very well but frankly it depends in whose hands it is in! As a novice (again after 40 years) my prefence would be fo a high wing tried and tested model and Vic Smeed did produce some some gems! On my return a year or two ago I built the Popsie with an original Mills 0.75. Just perfect!

I have also built his Mam'selle 150% with radio assist and electric because I wanted to explpore electric but diesels still have an irresistible charm.

If you cannot get an original Mills then I have reason to believe that the Red Finn diesels are quite good - probably can be saids to have mimicked  the Mills - similar displacement gives quite some grunt it appears. But nice long stroke and decidedly Millish?  They also do a .5cc I believe

www.Redfinengines.com

The Popsie.... bit like a Bumble Bee but flies just as well!  Oh and Gildings have an auction of model aircraft engines etc. on the 7th November but I don't think the the catalogue is out yet - last year some of the prices were eye watering - bordering on silly! www.gildings.co.uk  



Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on October 15, 2013, 05:27:44 PM
Looks like a Kingcat 1.5.

Thanks Dan , that's the one! I have a feeling this is still a bit bigger than I want. I managed to turn it over though. Sat in a tin box for 15 years. I will clean it up and fettle it.


David - I believe you are right, I'm thinking I need something a bit more robust. And I still fancy small. Maybe a Frog Zephr.


Any thoughts on smaller diesels? What are the DC Dart 0.5cc's like?


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: danmellor on October 15, 2013, 05:41:05 PM
I may have dreamed this, but I'm sure I remember that after the Kingcat and the Glocat, the guy responsible was planning a 0.5cc engine when he dropped dead at Old Warden.

Dan.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: FreeFlightModeller on October 15, 2013, 05:47:19 PM
Remind me never to make plans for a 0.5cc engine!


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: gossie on October 15, 2013, 07:38:22 PM
DC Darts are okay, but make sure to get a red head version as it seems the later gold head versions break crankshafts.
An Allbon Dart with green head or red head are much loved and will cost you more than the DC version.
I have a DC version in a small FF model 28in span, and it starts and runs well on a 7X3 propeller.  Fuel is simply a 1/3 of each kero, castor and ether.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on October 16, 2013, 07:19:39 AM
Thanks Gossie. I do like the idea of a small scale model.

So what should I use to clean up the Kingcat? I am a complete novice.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: glidermaster on October 16, 2013, 03:17:25 PM
Are there any 0.5cc diesels in current production - other than the PAW?

Nice size - good for small fields.
John


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Bryanair on October 16, 2013, 03:48:37 PM
Some good advice re. cleaning engines here - http://www.supercoolprops.com/articles/sticky_situation.php

Personally I've had good results immersing the engine in cellulose thinners but don't do this if there are plastic parts.

It is best not to dismantle an engine unless absolutely necessary.  If you do make sure that you mark everything so that you put it back together in exactly the same position.



Bryan


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: billdennis747 on October 16, 2013, 04:47:48 PM
John
The only .5 in production is the PAW and is probably the best bet in Canada. The alternative is a Dart but they will be rarer over there I assume.  The Dart is fine but if it breaks you will need someone to fix it. They share the same mounting dimensions. Be aware that the PAW is as powerful as a Mills 75. I gather there are some Russian Mills replicas over there but from recent experience, avoid like the plague.
My PAW starts and runs well, as do the others I have seen.
Are there small fields in Canada?!
Bill


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Hughs Aircraft on October 16, 2013, 06:41:49 PM
The September/October issue of Aeromodeller has an article about the "Red Fin Millish Diesels". There is an .049ci and a .030ci. Long stroke design and side port. 75 pounds for the .030 unit from www.Redfinengines.com.

I  hope this helps.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: DavidJP on October 17, 2013, 04:49:49 AM
I find the Dart a little difficult to start unless you get the the balance of the fuel tank just right.  But that could be me very out of practice after a 30 year gap! And I recall inverted was a bit tricky too. I found with diesels that after a little while one gets a familiarity with them and it all becomes a lot easier.

I have always liked the Frog designs - some were not the greatest of performers. This - the Linnett is quite appealing but not sure about it's suitability for Bowden - but very manageable size.

Remember that Redfin may be producing a 0.5.

I think if you go into the Redfin site you can open the Aeromodeller report.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: DHnut on October 17, 2013, 05:27:01 AM
Jon,
      I have some experience with a range of small diesels in neezers and scale models. The Banks mills replica's all start well and the .4cc works well in my vampire and venom neezers which when powered by a PAW 55 were nearly supersonic.
The Darts are fine mounted upright or side winder. The Redfin Millishes are very good and at least as powerful as a Mills. The .5 is also close to a Dart in performance. Mine both start as well as any Mills.
I have an AM 10 in an Auster AOP9 and it performs well in the inverted position provided it is primed carefully with the piston covering the exhaust ports. It is straight forward to start and requires very little adjustment.
Another trick we use is to increase the ether content in the fuel to 40% and this works well with sub 1cc diesels definitly improving starting and any loss of power is difficult to establish. There are some Aeromodeller articles in the 50's that discussed diesel fuels and their chemistry in detail.
Also as mentioned earlier getting the engine on the test stand and sorting out the settings is the only way to go.
Finally attention to tank height is very important and not always properly done. I have made that mistake on occasions and paid dearly for it.
Ricky   






 


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: DavidJP on October 17, 2013, 12:19:54 PM
Your comments on the Redfin engines are very helpful Ricky as I have not seen much from the "independent" sources.  I have to say they do rather appeal - particularly the 0.5.  Thanks also for agreeing the the tank height/balance can be a problem - as I said I thought it might have been me having "lost it". 


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: danmellor on October 17, 2013, 02:21:48 PM
Wish you hadn't mentioned this! I've not flown an IC model for maybe 15 years and now I'm hankering for the smell of burnt diesel permeating my clothes, car and house...

I've still got an Indian Mills 75, a PAW 1.5 (For a long-threatened return to C/L) and a Russian MK17. There's an ASP28 and a knackered HP40 somewhere, too.

I think I may feel the C/L model coming on...

Cheers,

Dan.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on October 17, 2013, 06:47:25 PM
Thanks for the pointers chaps. I will be trying to get the Kingcat going and maybe put it in a Bowden model for next year. If that goes ok I might look for a small diesel for FF scale.

Be nice if this thread rumbled on. Go for it Dan  :) I will be back with more questions.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: DHnut on October 17, 2013, 09:44:02 PM
Dan how does the idea of a model for the PMFC scale event sit. The Mk17 would be a good fit for a WW2 model with the lingish shaft and the needle out of the prop arc. As you say the smell is lovely. You only have to build it to the plan!
 To add a little bit of spice to the thread. Has any one experience with DC Bambi's. I have a Banks replica and almost lost it a short time ago because it runs a very long time on very little fuel. Also the Tomthumb it was in is very small which gave retrival challenges. The DC one I have was really difficult to start initially, ( not run in ) but seems to be improving. It will need some further running before it is put in a model.
The other underated engine is the DC Merlin. A good one and they do vary starts easily and develops a useful amount of power. One thing to watch is that some are insentive to needle and may benefit from sleeving the intake, as has been well documented in SAM35 and somewhere in Areomodeller. I had this same problem with the AM10. It showed as an unwillingness to throttle and a lack of sensitivity to needle position. A double aluminium tube sleeve fixed it totally and this engine is very close to and AM15 being only a matter of 400 rpm down on the same 8x4 prop.
Jon what about somthing like a Ladybird with a big draggy cowling and does look a bit Beaver like.
There I have srirred the pot.
Ricky
   
       


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: danmellor on October 18, 2013, 04:25:05 PM
Thinking about it, my last F/F diesel model was a KK Southerner Mite from the Ben Buckle kit, built around 1996...

It was one of two or three models I've built in 35 years that genuinely flew "off the board" with no trimming being needed. DC Dart on a 7x3 prop and off it went in left hand circles and a left glide. Turned a fair bit of the kitchen floor purple whilst dying Modelspan with Dylon...

Cheers,

Dan.


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Kurt on October 20, 2013, 04:43:56 PM
Dear Yak52,
I have just had a quik look to the contributions to your question about 1ccm Diesels. I used exclusively Diesel Power in my youth in free flight competition models. In a nostalgia access I came back this year to diesel application in oldtimer designs, but had to make a survey where to get nowadays a good Diesel. I found out three companies, you may find them all in the internet. The first is PAW of England where a bought a magnific 3cc Diesel, but this size is not your case. But PAW produces also !cc Diesels, which I personally did not try out. Second is the MP Jet 1 cc Diesel of the Czech Republic. I bought one and can assure you that it is a very reliable and powerful engine. If you dont flood it, it starts at the first turns. The third one is a Schlosser 1cc replica which I bought at a german company called Arkai. Schlosser was a german mechanic, but I heared that an American is building the perfect (!!!) replicas in California(???) this is also a perfect engine. Both the MP Jet as well as the Schlosser run very reliably, powerful and have good idling. I have run both during the last two weeks now and I am fully satisfied. If you cannot find the PAW, Schlosser and MP Jet I can give you more exact adresses for purchase,
Good Luck
Kurt


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Bryanair on October 21, 2013, 09:50:05 AM
Jon

The Gildings auction catalogue will be available on-line this coming Friday October 25th.

http://www.gildings.co.uk/auction_calendar.php?sale_id=1528

My PAW 1cc (bought new) has flown my AW FK8 WW1 biplane 43" and my DHC-2 Beaver 48" although the Beaver currently has a DC Sabre 1.5cc in it because I wanted to swing a bigger prop past the radial cowl.

One thing I think you need to weigh up is it better to buy brand new and know that the engine will be a good runner or buy a 50 year old engine that has probably seen a lot of use and been mistreated along the way?

I once bought an engine at a swapmeet that appeared OK but when I put a screwdriver on one of the cylinder head screws I found that the screw was broken with a short bit still lodged in the crankcase.  An engineer friend sorted that out but then I discovered it needed a rebore!
Bryan


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: ffkiwi on February 07, 2014, 08:48:20 PM
Schlossers are no longer in production and are very expensive [but superbly made-I have three]. I have to echo both Bill and Ricky's comments-you cannot go past an original Mills 75 or 1.3 for scale work. That being said-the MP Jet Classic 0.6 is just as powerful as a Mills 75 and handles just as well as the best Mills 75. I own half a dozen of each so have plenty of experience with them for comparison. About the only criticism I'd make of the Classic is its two bolt beam mount-which does deny you the ability of easy thrust line adjustment via washers that we're used to with traditional 4-point beam mounting. [mind you the ED Baby was the same-and an awful lot of those were sold and used!] The nice thing about the MP Jet (apart from its general availability) is it's a virtual drop in replacement in size weight and power for the Mills 75. The 1.3 has some modern replicas (CS/Boddo and Redfin)-but the jury is still out on the latter as to whether they are half decent or not. The Indian ones are no longer being produced.
   I doubt that the 1cc MP Jets are of much use for scale-they are high revving front rotary jobs-great for R/C and F/F duration-but not especially amenable to big props.
  The Russian Mk-17 has been touched on earlier-these are readily found on Ebay, are ball raced, and have a nice long shaft that's useful in some scale situations. By and large there seems to be a preference for rear induction engines for FF scale-if for no other reason that the difficulties of accessing controls under a cowling with FI engines. The preference for sideports is understandable with their ability to turn a large (often scale diameter) prop, good suction and integral tanks-and their generally easy starting docile handling and lack of fiddliness.
  Mind you-even the master, Eric Coates was not averse to using ED Super Furys and ED Racers if the power needs of the model dictated...........and these are still around if you look.

  One area that might be worth investigating-and to the best of my extensive knowledge, no one has ever done it-would be a diesel conversion of the Cox Queen Bee 074. Now this engine was less than impressive in glow form-but the head is the same dimensions as the TD/Medallion 09-so an aftermarket (MECOA?) diesel head ought to work on it-and allow it to turn 7" and 8" props. It's rear induction, has a throttle-and a nice long NVA, and isn't too heavy.
    Hmmn-I have one-and a Mecoa Cox09 diesel  head somewhere-methinks some investigation is in order.................

 ChrisM
'ffkiwi'


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: DHnut on February 08, 2014, 09:42:15 PM
I have just finished running the recently arrived Red Phin 1cc and the results were very good. Then first start was on the third flick and after a futher 2 tanks I progressively up the compression and leaned the engine out. The tank is good for at least 4 minutes when running on a 9x4 that was used. All four of the Red Phin engines that I have have shown excellent starting that is at least as good as any of the Mills or replicas I own and my impression is that they are all turning a little faster. The 1.5 is lighter at 106 grms than the 1.3 Mills and the extra capacity definitely gives it an edge. The 1cc weighs 74 grams and dropps into a .75 mounting; just the job for a marginally powered scale model. The .75 weighs 64 grams. If these standards of production are maintained then there is a viable substitute for a Mills. The fuel mix used was 40% ether, 25% castor/synthetic oil, 1.5% DII with the remainder being kerosene.   
Ricky


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: ffkiwi on February 08, 2014, 10:24:36 PM
That's good news Ricky-reports elsewhere (Barton site for example) indicate the engines are OK-and the vendor service top notch-but they haven't been around very long and have yet to make their presence felt much on the flying field. Apropos to my earlier comment above on the Queen Bee-I've dug the various bits out-test fitted the Mecoa head and it looks like the conversion is quite feasible. Give me a week or so and I should be able to report back with some test figures.

 ChrisM
 'ffkiwi'


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on October 24, 2017, 07:40:56 AM
Hi Chaps,

I've decided to sell the Kingcat as I have too many other projects at the moment. Its cleaned up and turns over - any ideas what it might be worth?

Thanks,
Jon


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Bryanair on October 24, 2017, 08:49:58 AM
Gildings sale results here:-

https://www.gildings.co.uk/sale_results/?search=kingcat

I believe Ray Hall is/was selling a Kingcat for £45 recently.

Bryan


Title: Re: Diesels for FF Scale
Post by: Yak 52 on October 24, 2017, 09:14:56 AM
Ok thanks Bryan. I've just put it on ebay: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Kingcat-1-5cc-Model-Diesel-Engine/272899969320 with no box or documentation I don't expect it will fetch much but we'll see :)

I'd probably rather get a hold of a smaller diesel at some point - since I tend to build small :)