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Author Topic: Veco/Dumas Dakota Biplane  (Read 2172 times)
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Bingo Fuel
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« on: May 06, 2012, 08:40:08 PM »

Hi All,  I found a plan with all patterns of a Dumas Dakota and understand it is a good flier.  Anyone out there have experience with this design and any advice as to engines?  I have a nice running India made Mills .75 diesel that I am considering or is this too much engine?  Also are there any design improvments for the plan before I go and build one.  I want to keep it vintage looking and don't want to change much.  I am surprized at the left thrust for the engine but I guess it is built for it.  Any coments on the left thrust?  ANy help will be welcome.  Bingo Fuel
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NormF
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« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2012, 10:00:55 PM »

Dakota is a fun plane! Build it per plan, including the left thrust. Mills should be fine. Mine has a Cox product motor with the helicopter tank. It's over powered but added shims to the head and fly with a 7-4 prop. Launch/bank left of the wind or it may start looping - be ready to duck! Don't fly near other folks!

- Norm
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Bingo Fuel
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« Reply #2 on: May 06, 2012, 10:17:34 PM »

Thanks for the info.  I may try to pick up an old OK Cub .049 for power.  I may build more than one with different power. The Mills .75 is beam mounted so can't exchange engines with a radial mount. I would think a bit of downthrust would stop the looping.  My first powered free flight was a Guillows Cessna 150 without much downthrust and it looped quite fast  on me and almost took off the back of my head.  The plan for the Dakota is on Outerzone if you folks want to see it. Everything about it is quite simple but has a strange wing build. Tough little bipe tough.  Bingo Fuel
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BlueBaron
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« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2012, 11:33:04 AM »

Are you building the .020 or .049 version of the Dakota?
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gcb
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« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2012, 11:25:46 AM »

Thanks for the info.  I may try to pick up an old OK Cub .049 for power.  I may build more than one with different power. The Mills .75 is beam mounted so can't exchange engines with a radial mount. I would think a bit of downthrust would stop the looping... 

Bingo Fuel
Bingo,
Joe Wagner (designer of the Dakota) said that he tried various power available at the time, including an OK Cub .09 with success.

I agree with Norm, build per plan...at least the first one. I believe Joe had a specific flight pattern in mind when he built it, and many, many have been built since.

George
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Bingo Fuel
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« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2012, 08:38:38 PM »

Hi again.  As far as I know there was only the one Dakota which is 24" wing span.  The original plan called for the use of three different engines, the OK Cub .049 (the early A model would probably be better without the huge tank), the K&B .035 and the Baby Spitfire .045.  It would be hard to find glow plugs for the K&B so I rulled that out.  The Baby Spitfire would be alright but is sort of rare.  The OK Cubs are as plentiful as can be.  I do have a nice "B" model of the engine but I am going with a Czech built MP Jet 040 Diesel which can run slower with  bit more control.  I suppose a regular old Cox .020 Pee Wee would be fine too.  I believe a Cox .049 Baby Bee would be just too much power.  I think the Mills .75 diesel would be fine but maybe a bit heavy.  I am not into electric for power as I have no intrest in that.  I love internal cumbustion engines and that is that. 
  I picked up the July issue of Flying models magazne and was surprized to see an article on the "Baby Biwinger" 13 "w/s which was first published in April 1952 issue of "Air Trails" Magazine.  Talk of a little brother to the Dakota!! It was deigned by Lud Kading and was originally to be powered by a K&B .020  Infant which would be hard to come by these days.  The author to the current Flying Models article installed a Cox.010 Tee Dee which would be fine in my opinion.  I myself have built a scale model  free flight with the same 13" wing span using that Cox engine and the power was just right.    This aircraft is all 1/16" sheet wood and is so simple and easy to build that it could be built in a day.  I have a couple Cox.010s so I am going to give it a try.  I know the.010s are not available anymore and the ones on eBay are selling quite high these days but I'm not an engine collector and intend to use mine. The engine uses the small plastic back plate and the fuel tank is just a length of fuel line inside the cabin. The fuel line is hooked to a small length of brass tube in the fire wall which faces forward to use prop blast as pressure  for the fuel.  I love the vintage design and if you see it you will see what I am talking about when I say it is the Dakota's little brother.  So either dig out your old Air Trails to check it out or get a copy of Flying Models July 2012.  Bye or now.  Bingo Fuel
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NormF
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« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2012, 09:54:29 PM »

A Babe Bee is a really good match. It has an attached tank and mount and will bolt right on the firewall. There were many versions of the Bee and many had a single bypass. This is less power than say the product motor I'm using. Dealing with beam mounts and separate tanks is a pain.

- N
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