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Author Topic: Bungee Launch 36" Gliders  (Read 34861 times)
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skyrocket
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« Reply #225 on: September 17, 2014, 05:05:19 PM »

We had another 36" Bungee contest last weekend at Geneseo, NY, and had about 7-8 flyers. The weather was pretty "IFFY" but the thermals were around. We flew to 3 x 60 sec. maxes with 1 minute increments thereafter. Jim Moseley and I made the maxes and settled down for our 2 minute maxes. I didn't think the air was that good so I didn't light the fuse....BIG mistake... my Retroglide-II went up to the top of the line and transitioned perfectly and started to go up in the elevator!!...my timer and I watched it go into the cloud base at 16 min. 41 sec and OOS...Jim flew next and made 53 sec and I was relieved I didn't have to fly my Corsair backup...he is a tough competitor and his mini Walkin Shoes has a beautiful glide. Highly recommended....so now I shall build another Retroglide-II but I will add a Texas Timer and set it NO MATTER WHAT...during the last 3-4 weeks my flying partner and I have been flying 20" to 30" British kit gliders for giggles on a smaller bungee of 15 feet of 3/32" of rubber and 30 feet of kite string on our Polo field testing site...WHAT FUN !!!...the KK Dolphin really looks pretty up in the air and Howard's Frog Wren has a beautiful glide...maybe there should be two classes : one for models per kit plans prior to 1960 and one for own designs with locked down surfaces Huh...any thoughts guys and dolls?
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FreeFlightModeller
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« Reply #226 on: September 17, 2014, 07:30:33 PM »

Glad to hear of others enjoying flying this class .... it is the best kind of flying I have had in the past year or so.
Good to hear that yours and Jim's models are performing well too.
At the Peterborough comp there were plenty of the classic designs flying .... I still want to try these as well as new designs. I think I prefer it 'all in one', but perhaps with a winner for pre1960 designs too.
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skyrocket
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« Reply #227 on: September 19, 2014, 10:38:50 AM »

"all in one" works well and we get to see some pretty nifty designs being flown and as long as we keep it locked down surfaces, we won't have any problems...one thing I noticed when flying in a good breeze is that as it approaches the top, the line and rubber stretches even more and you get extra altitude as it pings off...the other thing is I feel that a auto rudder is essential and proper placement of the hook can make a winner out of a previous dog...being a newcomer to glider flying, I'm having a ball!!! and I'm very happy Western New York Free Flight Society added it to their contest calendar...
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applehoney
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« Reply #228 on: October 14, 2014, 02:33:50 PM »

A photo of my mini Walkin' Shoes going up on the bungee came to me yesterday; no idea yet of whom the photographer was
Attached files Thumbnail(s):
Re: Bungee Launch 36" Gliders
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PeeTee
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« Reply #229 on: October 14, 2014, 02:48:34 PM »

Jim

Luvverly - how about a plan for the builders gallery........please!

Peter
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skyrocket
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« Reply #230 on: October 14, 2014, 03:26:28 PM »

Jim...nice shot of her going up in the elevator !!!...just finished a new RetroGlide so I'll be testing that until the weather clamps down...or am I dreaming about the weather again?...in any case, I'll fly until the fingers get too stiff or the rum doesn't work...did you finish the Walthew?
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« Reply #231 on: October 14, 2014, 03:42:53 PM »

Looks great Jim  Smiley ... doesn't look mini at all in that shot.

With a pool of young keen retrievers, this class would be so good for those that can't tow or chase a model very well.
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applehoney
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« Reply #232 on: October 14, 2014, 03:55:15 PM »

>   a plan for the builders gallery.

I don't really have one ....  I just tile-printed off the 88"  (as copied from MA page of long ago ) to 36", taped together the sheets and then pencilled in suitably amended structure for that size.  The sheets are now really confusing!

Walthew, Dave?   No ...   wouldn't take too much now to finish the clunker though but the incentive is lacking. Maybe sometime through the winter.
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« Reply #233 on: October 14, 2014, 08:07:57 PM »

What a neat shot of your mini Walkin' Shoes. Nice traditional proportions.
John
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FLYBOY49
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« Reply #234 on: October 14, 2014, 11:01:57 PM »

Jim,

Beautiful has been said.  It's true.

Something I notice.  I've been having difficulty getting my bungee tow ring to release from the tow hook as it should.  My flag is very near the tow ring.  I see that you have yours about a yard down the tow line.  Is this better than up close to the ring?

Van...
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applehoney
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« Reply #235 on: October 14, 2014, 11:53:07 PM »

Not my line, Van - but I really do not see how flag position is likely to make much difference.    I did find that angling the tow hook a little downwards made a positive difference compared to the more usual practice of it being parallel to the bottom of the fuselage.  Broadly speaking, when towing the line is flicked off the hook by releasing some line tension - with bungee the ring slides off the hook as line slackens and the angle helps it do so. 

I think ....   all speculation   Grin
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FLYBOY49
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« Reply #236 on: October 15, 2014, 12:14:50 AM »

Thanx, Jim.

I had been thinking that I had too strong of a bungee and too short of a line.  What I've been using is a hi start from long ago, before I knew about the 36" glider class.  It's made up of 'about' 15 or 20 feet of small surgical tubing (May 3/16" O.D.) and again, 'about' 30 or 35 feet of heavy duty fishing line.

If I resist stretching the bungee out more than about an extra 30 feet, it releases just fine.  But, it doesn't have much altitude.

However, If I do stretch it out to about 3 times it relaxed length, the model ( a Cadet) reaches good altitude and refuses to release.  Even with the tow hook rebent downward to about a 30 degree angle from the datum line.

Boy is that thrilling to endure. !!!!  On occasions, it has transitioned into a dive at tremendous speed, heading for Tera firma with the tow line still pulling hard on the tow hook.

All this while the other end is attached to an anchor in or on the ground.

Van...
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billdennis747
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« Reply #237 on: October 15, 2014, 04:57:25 AM »

What a neat shot of your mini Walkin' Shoes. Nice traditional proportions.
John
Ditto. That could be the classic glider I've been looking for, although I thought squillions of riblets was the curse of the scale model!
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skyrocket
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« Reply #238 on: October 15, 2014, 08:43:38 AM »

This is a good discussion going on about the mechanics of bungee. I set ours up per the way the Brits are doing their bungee - 7.5 meters of 1/8" rubber plus 22.5 meters of 30# kite string. I did add a 1" dowel about 2 feet long as an anchor and a eyebolt on top to connect the line and an eyebolt and rope  plus tent peg. I placed the 9" square flag about 12"-15" down from the tow ring and recently added a release pin for auto-rudder. This set up hasn't failed me yet and I haven't had any negative feed back. We all use the same bungee for the contests. Jim is right about angling the tow hook slightly downward, it works great. Release is a function of where the hook is in relation to the CG and a good place to start is about 20 degrees forward of the CG. With my gliders so far, I pace off about 30 strides to start off and about 40 to 45 at the most. Without an auto-rudder you are pretty much stuck with a straight glide to stop the swerve to either side. And lining up with the wind is important too. Hope this helps. Like PeeTee says, they have a mind of their own when they want to release.
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applehoney
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« Reply #239 on: October 15, 2014, 09:20:01 AM »

> squillions of riblets

Omitted on the 36"    Grin
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FLYBOY49
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« Reply #240 on: March 29, 2015, 12:42:13 PM »

 Undecided

I recently repaired my CADET glider and also built a new bungee launcher outta 1/8" rubber and halibut fishing line. 25' of rubber and 75' of line, with a bandana as a flag attached in the open position a short way below the tow ring.  It works a treat!!!

I was surprised that that small of a rubber band could tow that model up to altitude.

I flew it on our frozen lake several times and although it is not thermal season here, it got over a minute flights with regularity without stretching the rubber to it's maximum length.

I love that glider so much that I took the plan to a copy shop and had it reduced to a 36" wing span and am making balsa dust inna cabin, frantically trying to assemble it as a possible model for this falls SAM CHAMPS in Nevada.

Van...
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skyrocket
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« Reply #241 on: March 29, 2015, 03:24:52 PM »

ATTA boy!!!!...that's the stuff we are talking about here...It's amazing how many designs out there lend themselves to bungee. You can fly larger models on the same 1/8" rubber but you have to walk back a lot farther than the typical 30 t0 40 paces we use because of the weight. This spring we will try larger models at the HOBO meet in Geneseo, NY, with a little heavier rubber and A2 size models in hopes that some flyers who can't run anymore will dust off the cobwebs of some great A2 designs they use to fly. The nice thing about bungee is you can fly alone and do it anytime for as long as you want.
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« Reply #242 on: August 27, 2015, 12:39:02 AM »

Guys,

I am almost finished with a reduced to 36" W.S. Cadet.  Still needs color, (Colour for the Brits.) and trim.  But, I did fly it at our Alaska Fall Old Timer (SAM) contest.  It flew a treat!!!

I didn't stretch the bungee to the max. Only a few steps backward stretching the bungee a bot for a test flight.  In almost still air (I did notice a bit of lift) I got about 2 minutes with it.

It's covered in light weight Polyspan from Larry Davidson.  3 coats of thinned Gelatin to seal the fabric and a single coat of 50/50 Nitrate dope.

My plan is to finish it and fly it at Eldorado Dry Lake, Boulder City, Nevada  in the U.S. SAM Champs in October.

It and a Tomboy or two may be the only planes I can ship down this year.

Although I do intend to try to build a Frog Wren also.  It's only one of many on my 'TO BUILD' list.  But, life's interruptions seem to slow down my building dreams.

Van...
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skyrocket
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« Reply #243 on: August 27, 2015, 12:01:12 PM »

Yep...you got the bug. I lost my #3 RetroGlide at Geneseo when I put a 2 min fuse on it and it went deep into the corn so I built #IV last week. Still waiting to test glide it but it LOOKS promising. On bungee gliders less than 30" span, we use 3/32" rubber  of reduced length along with a reduced kite string. It works well on small fields but still gives good flights long enough to work out the trimming. With 1/8" rubber, 30 to 40 paces is the norm. I did try a full size glider on 3/16" rubber and found I had to step a little further back with a glider weighing 10-11 oz. Of the 3 sizes of models, I like the 36" bungee the best. BTW, you don't have to fly old designs in bungee in this country although they look great in the air.
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FLYBOY49
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« Reply #244 on: August 27, 2015, 12:36:08 PM »

This CADET glider is an old timer design that I thank Jim Mossley (APPLEHONEY) for.  The original that I built as best I could from foreign wording was made from wood I harvested from behind my shop here in Willow, Alaska.  Spruce, Birch and Poplar.  very few pieces of balsa in it.  I covered the original with full strength Polyspan and finished it with Nitrate dope.  It took forever to build since I had to sorta kiln dry the wood strips with trouble trying to keep it from wrapping up like pretzel sticks.  But, it flys a treat!

I had a copy shop reduce it to a 36" W.S. for me.  It took several attempts since the kid running the copy shop wasn't the sharpest pencil in the drawer.  And I paid for all the attempts to make it far and get the copy size I wanted.  It was all worth the effort.  BTW:  the reduced one is almost all balsa. But, with hard wood longerons and spars. It does take a bit of lead in the nose to balance it.  And I did make a home designed D.T. hinge for the tail outta soldering lugs and aluminum tubing.  Crude.  But, it works fine.  Gotta figure out how to rig a timer release to it before I take it to Nevada.

Next time I'm going to use full strength Poly Span on the Fuselage.  The light weight stuff dents and punctures too easily.  I am, however sold on using the Gelatin to fill the fabric before doping.  Apply it thinned a bunch and it adds almost no weight.  Then it takes a minimum of dope to finish it.

Thanx, Jim.

Van...
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applehoney
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« Reply #245 on: August 27, 2015, 02:18:18 PM »

Very welcome, Van
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FLYBOY49
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« Reply #246 on: December 03, 2015, 10:12:55 PM »

I have been delinquent in not telling of my luck at the SAM CHAMPS.

I won 3rd place in the Old Timer F/F glider contest with my CADET glider that I built outta mostly hard wood collected out behind my shop last year. It is that glider that I built from Jim Moseley's plan that was written in some foreign language.  Guys on SAMTalk helped me decipher the words I needed and I could measure the sticks on  the drawing myself.

Anyway, I managed to anchor down 3rd place with it at the CHAMPS.  WHOOPEE!

I scaled it down to a 36" wing span and took that reduced size model along, also. But, I didn't do so well with that one.  I had stronger competition in that category. Still came in at 4th place, I think. Not inna money, tho.

I did get 2nd in Twin Pusher.  WOW! For me that's a real shot in the arm.  I also got the 'last to be issued' certificate of induction in the 'NUTWORTHY TWIN PUSHER SOCIETY'. Grant Carson is retiring from that life long role.

Thanx again, Jim.

Van...
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skyrocket
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« Reply #247 on: December 04, 2015, 11:03:44 AM »

I think this bungee stuff is getting a hold here. The 30" Lulu does fly better with the auto-rudder attached. I haven't tried it on a 1/8" rubber bungee yet, just the 3/32"" rubber set-up at 15 ft. rubber/30 ft. kite string...just right for a small field. I'm building a Keil Kraft 30" Cadet right now. A nice old design so far. I had thought of the 30" Sinbad but there was just too much wood in it...speaking of twin pushers, I do have a 20" job I put together using an old Embryo wing and it is a lot of fun flying it on 2- 1/8" motors and they are very strange trimming out. Also, carving a left hand prop was strange but fun. I was lucky in finding a good all metal old egg beater in a antique store. Not with pressed steel gears but real gears. I wrapped and soldered the hooks on the shafts and it works nice. The manufacturer was "Daisey" and it looks to be late 40's to early 50's. I'll be taking a 36" bungee glider (RetroGlide-IV) and an unlimited size glider down to Palm Bay the 27th. to fly in the KOI meet on a bungee.
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skyrocket
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« Reply #248 on: December 25, 2015, 01:23:20 PM »

Both the KK Cadet and the Mini-Lulu fly great on the bungee...do add auto-rudders to these little beauties...they go straight up to the top of the line and ping off nicely when you angle the hook downwards a little...and add plenty of lightness...the KK Cadet has a lot of potential at only 30" span...I got the KK Cadet off Outerzone.com and the LULU from a old Aero Modeller...
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« Reply #249 on: December 27, 2015, 01:22:13 PM »

My Christmas break build.
 
My build time is fractured into small bits of time each day.  So, for this build I kinda kept track of the approximate time it took each day to build this Bob Holman short kit on Jim O'Reilly plan. I didn't  include the little time it took to gather some sticks from my stash in another building.
 
Wings: A couple half hour sessions, which included gluing together the Stabilizer.
 
Fuselage: A bit longer since it took a bunch of fiddling and jigging.  Approximately  3 hours total.
 
All total, the fastest and easiest build ever!
 
For some reason I am unable to shrink the pic's to a sendable size.
 
Van...
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