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Author Topic: Winding Tubes  (Read 1214 times)
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calgoddard
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« on: January 26, 2014, 06:59:34 PM »

I currently wind my P-30 and my FAC airplanes (besides Phantom Flash) the traditional way.  Namely, I first load the unwound motor into the fuselage with a stuffer stick, and insert the hollow motor peg through the rear ends of the loops. I put the plane on my stooge and stick the pin through the trunions of the stooge and through the motor peg.  I install a blast tube over the motor, wind the motor, remove the blast tube, connect the front end of the motor to the prop and insert the prop block into the fuselage.  I won't get into the details of the specific steps that are involved when I use a GizmoGeezer prop but they are pretty easy.

I hear that there is a device called a winding tube.  I read a description of this technique and it made no sense to me.  

See http://members.shaw.ca/climber/ff/ff_field_procedures.html

See the write up below the picture of the stooge.  The description of the winding technique starts with "All models will be wound using the following method."

The motor is apparently wound outside the airplane inside the winding tube. The winding tube and the wound motor are then installed inside the airplane and the motor peg is inserted.  Somehow the winding tube is removed and the prop block inserted.  The description indicates that the prop is attached to the motor and then the winding tube is removed. How in the world is it removed over the prop? Can Someone please enlighten me on the winding tube technique?  Thank you.  
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NormF
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« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2014, 07:24:40 PM »

The winding tube is open on one side, the entire length. It sits in the stooge like a "U" shaped trough. The rear peg is held by a fork in the rear. When wound, the tube and rubber is inserted in the fuse, a second, smaller rear peg is inserted (there are alternate ways of doing this) anchoring the rubber motor. The already attached prop is lifted up, out of the tube and the tube slides out the front. Once you see it done it becomes very clear.

Look at the tubes in the pic. You can see that they are completly open on one side.

Norm
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calgoddard
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« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2014, 08:05:37 PM »

Thanks for your input.  I have been to many outdoor contests and have never seen any person wind this way, including a number nationally known rubber power free flight experts.  Maybe I should ask them why they do not use this technique.   
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NormF
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« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2014, 08:31:34 PM »

It's almost universal in the FAI events, F1b and F1g. You have a limited window to fly in, you can wind multiple motors while waiting for lift. The system allows removing a fully wound motor and inserting a fresh one.

Norm
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Tmat
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« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2014, 09:17:25 PM »

There is almost no F1B flyers left in North America (maybe the world?) that does not use the external winding 1/2 tube. Many advantages. You can wind with wild abandon without any worry that you will damage the model if the motor breaks. You can wind multiple motors and chose which "feels" best after winding. You can quickly remove a wound motor from a model if you feel you have been waiting too long for a thermal and wish to exchange with a fresh motor (we do this in F1B).

I might be the only one using a 1/2 tube for P30.

To answer your questions Cal, typically the 1/2 tube is inserted in the model, then a wire is placed through a "bobbin" (my P-30 uses a T-hook) and while holding the wire, the 1/2 tube is extracted. There is usually another bobbin at the rear of the motor. The bobbin fits into a slot in the rear of the 1/2 tube, meaning that it can just be pulled out straight after the rear peg is installed.
By the way, with F1B and F1G, the rear bobbin typically has a set of hooks attached to it that allow you to install the 1/2 tube onto the rear peg without removing the rear peg. It is placed into the motor tube at a 90 degree angle then twisted 90 degrees to horizontal like a bayonet fitting.

Here are some photos and details of my P-30 1/2 tube system as used by my nephew. https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/105619038517716117641/albums/5514383108968981025

Should answer most of your questions.

Tony
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calgoddard
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« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2014, 04:30:21 AM »

Tony - Thanks for the very helpful explanation and the pictures.  Winding tubes may have been in use the first time I went to an outdoor event a number of years ago where they may have been flying Coupe (F1G).  I didn't know enough to even look for different winding techniques.  I have mostly gone to FAC contests and am just now getting into the P-30 class of outdoor rubber powered aircraft.
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Art356A
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« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2014, 09:52:20 AM »

How do you make the tubes?
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« Reply #7 on: January 29, 2014, 01:39:39 PM »

How do you make the tubes?
My tube was a piece of 1/2" diameter, thin wall aluminum tube (Home Depot) that was cut on a bandsaw, and hand filed to shape. The larger tubes are typically milled to shape but could be hand cut as well with simple tools.

Tmat
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DerekMc
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« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2014, 01:56:56 PM »

If you like to live an exciting life have at it with a Dremel cutoff disc. Goes through thinned walled aluminum like a hot knife through butter.
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Derek
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« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2014, 02:03:36 PM »

Yes, that will work Derek. But the sucker would get hot (the tube that is). Bandsaw was quick and I have one at work.

Tony
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DerekMc
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« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2014, 02:05:02 PM »

Yes, that will work Derek. But the sucker would get hot (the tube that is). Bandsaw was quick and I have one at work.

Tony

The heat is one of the reasons for the excitement!
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Derek
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« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2014, 01:58:49 AM »

External winding is the way to go and you can make the rear pins out of aluminum tubing with plywood shoulders, instead of Delrin which means no lathe is necessary. I make half tubes out of 1/2" CPVC.
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