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Author Topic: Me 109 e - D. Mc Hard  (Read 4758 times)
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Modelace
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« Reply #25 on: June 18, 2016, 09:42:36 PM »

Nice work Marco...I am just curious why you chose to plank the fuselage all the way to the cockpit ? I plank the first couple bays to make the nose more "crunch proof" in a hard landing and to add a bit of noseweight.
You have enough to give the fuselage an absolute scale elliptical shape !

Bob
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Marco
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« Reply #26 on: June 19, 2016, 06:26:50 AM »

Ciao John. My customer is very happy - I am going to tackle the wing soon and he is looking forward to helping me out !
Bob, thanks for your comments. By the way, you are the culprit if I started this thread - seeing your Ki-61 coming together so smoothly and nicely made me forget the usual troubles (cats, domestic chores, cleaning up the mess and the dust every time e.a. ) that keep me away from building every now and then. The reason for the extensive planking is, unfortunately, very simple. I could say that it is as per the plan but it would be a lie - I never built a model respecting the plan 100%....the reason is that, statistically, all my models ended up being tail heavy. I build for fun, I am not selecting specific grades of balsa and so everytime, after frantic efforts to save some fraction of gram here and there (weight police....), I have to add the usual lump of clay in the front  Angry . I am getting better in reducing the amount of ballast but I am not there yet and this model in particular has a lot of timber in the back, despite my attempts to lighten it a bit. So I decided that, if noseweight must be, at least it will serve some structural and cosmetic purpose, instead of being just a lazy ballast ! In other words, this is my 'bit of noseweight' ....
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Modelace
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« Reply #27 on: June 19, 2016, 10:48:17 AM »

Ah Marco..."The Weight Police'. They lurk everywhere !.
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Marco
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« Reply #28 on: June 21, 2016, 03:46:27 PM »

I have seen the great canopy frame made by Pit and I decided to follow the same approach. I like the results
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Re: Me 109 e - D. Mc Hard
Re: Me 109 e - D. Mc Hard
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Marco
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« Reply #29 on: June 21, 2016, 03:47:24 PM »

...and then I noticed the disclaimer :"Don't ask me how I am going to attach the transparent..."....
I shall invent something....
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ZK-AUD
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« Reply #30 on: June 21, 2016, 04:57:48 PM »

Hi Marco - RC56 or similar clear canopy glue would be my recommendation - you can tape the panels in place and then just apply the glue thinned with a few drops of water using a small brush (00 or thereabouts) to the joins - capillary action will wick it along everywhere - no smudges.  Just remember to wash your brush out immediately or you'll be buying another one! Grin
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OZPAF
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« Reply #31 on: June 21, 2016, 07:45:10 PM »

You have good hands making that miniscule canopy frame Marco. The customer will need to consider increasing your commission Smiley

John
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THB
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« Reply #32 on: June 23, 2016, 07:10:27 AM »

Nice work Marco - should be a fun plane to finish and fly from here.
cheers - Tim










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Tim
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Marco
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« Reply #33 on: June 23, 2016, 02:56:30 PM »

Thanks for comments.
I will try to find the glue - currently my priority is to scan all the shelves at the shopping mall to find some suitable transparent packaging to cut the 'glass' from
The customer is very very happy !
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« Reply #34 on: June 23, 2016, 03:16:12 PM »

Hi again Marco,

one good source is OHP transparency film.  Don't know who still uses overhead projectors but you can still buy the film - you get 50 or more sheets in a packet for next to nothing
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Marco
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« Reply #35 on: June 27, 2016, 02:25:17 PM »

Still crawling along....parked for a while the canopy, I tackled the wing. A couple of thoughts :
- the profile looks a bit thick - so it the model won't fly well , I have found already the excuse.... Grin Grin Grin
- the kind of Phillips entry of the profile seems to naturally introduce some washout; but I will introduce some anyway
- the structure has only one deep spar. Perhaps it is ok at the original model scale, but to me it looks like a not very efficient use of the wood. I decided to use three thinner stringers plus one on the bottom (only on the inner bays). Weight should be more or less the same, structural strength as well (perhaps slightly better), smoothness of the profile should improve.

This is the result. Still the tips to be done, some reinforcement at the gun stations to be added, I want to add some scrap balsa along the upper contour of the inner ribs to help the mating with the fuselage. But it is basically there
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Re: Me 109 e - D. Mc Hard
Re: Me 109 e - D. Mc Hard
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Marco
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« Reply #36 on: June 27, 2016, 02:35:41 PM »

To build in the washout, I stole the technique openly from Modelace thread on KI-61 (well, I am really stealing full hands from that thread and others ...), so I shimmed the trailing edge with a wedge and then I glued the stringers. A very minor trick - the trailing edge is notched, I tacked a strip of transparent adhesive tape on the bottom of the trailing edge, across the notches. In this way the bottom rear of the ribs is supported and aligned with the trailing edge surface, it can't go through.  White glue or CA does not stick to the tape, so when the wing is complete it is just a metter of peeling it off.
Now there is the real issue of this model - how to mate the wing and the fuselage ?
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Marco
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« Reply #37 on: June 27, 2016, 02:43:26 PM »

To be honest, I am surprised that a plan so detailed and drawn so nicely leaves the traveller in the woods when it comes to join the wing and the fuselage. I am definitely a dumb traveller but the fact that there is no former at the trailing edge station makes things quite difficult to me, to understand how to render the transition from a square section to a rounded one.
Furthermore, there is no wing saddle - I would be led to believe that, similar to the Koutny plans, one should cover the wing, attach it to the fuselage and then fix the last stringers trimming them on the fly. This would make difficult (again, to me...) to achieve a good covering of the fuselage. Done already on my G55, would rather prefer to do it differently now.
So, first of all I guesstimated a wing saddle to provide the attachment points to the side stringers and then I planked the front part of the wing bayotherwise there would be no way to attach the tissue later
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Marco
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« Reply #38 on: June 27, 2016, 02:57:53 PM »

By the way, both the formers that are passing through the wing are wider than the distance between the two inner ribs. Furthermore, their sides have an angle, to match the dihedral angle of the ribs - but this makes impossible, even when sanded to the right width, to slide them through, because their bottom surface is obviously wider  than the available space on top of the ribs (narrow on top, wider on the bottom...). I do not know if have been very clear.....anyway, to me it is a puzzle.....
So, I sanded the formers to make them narrower and I think I might build some sort of slot between the two ribs to help the wing alignment.
With some scrap balsa I built a false former that I placed at the trailing edge station, this allowed an anchor point for the belly stringers.
However, I made a mistake, because I rounded the former. I should have left it square, now there is a gap that I do not think I can fill with the wing fillets.
I am going to make it square again and to add some short stringer to help driving the transition from a square section to an oval one.... Again, I do not understand why this thing is not detailed at all in the plan
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Modelace
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« Reply #39 on: June 27, 2016, 04:32:48 PM »

Marco: Many years ago, Iron Mike did a plan for me for a "Jumbo Scale" 109. He addressed your problem by adding a short "transition piece/stringer" from the bottom fuselage stringer to the wing t.e.
Attached a couple pictures to show the result.
By the way, My Midkiff 109 is one of only 2 ever built, the other one was converted to electric R/C.  My wing is removable for ease of transportation..
"No explanation on the plan" is a pretty common occurance (See my KI-61 thread). Why take all the fun out of it by providing ALL the answers ? Roll Eyes
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OZPAF
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« Reply #40 on: June 27, 2016, 06:35:35 PM »

Perhaps you may be able to just use a piece of vert grain balsa to join the fuselage former to the dihedral brace in the wing if they are close to each other? This may be a little lighter than building a "slot" between the ribs.

What does the customer suggest? Smiley

John
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Pit
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« Reply #41 on: June 28, 2016, 09:35:52 AM »

The inside of the center section of the trailing edge is directly in contact with the rear cockpit former.  The LE is (or should be) directly in contact with former 3.  Cover the center section only on the bottom.  I cheated on the former with the dihedral angles by trimming the offenders off so that the wing goes neatly into place, making contact at that former only at the top of the rib.  You can then add a bit of scrap for full contact to the rib thru the cockpit opening.  Once you get the fairings on, the wing mount will be rock solid.

I left off the lower rear stringers until I get all the wing mating issues taken care of (might have been the reason that I haven't finished it yet...), but it is now solved Smiley.

I hope the above makes sense,  I wrote it, read it and... Huh
 Wink Grin
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Marco
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« Reply #42 on: July 03, 2016, 08:01:40 AM »

Hi all. A short pause in the building...but I am recovering.
Bob, thanks for the pictures. You are right, part of the fun is 'filling the gaps' and circumventing this sort of issues... Grin...in this case it is really a matter of filling a gap !
John, the customer is just supervising and reminding me to be on schedule...he does not care about minor details...
Pit, what you are writing makes a lot of sense...happy to know that I am following your same path !
Anyway, I think I have found  a good way forward finally . I added a couple of small pieces of balsa to make the extra former I introduced square on the corners. Then I added a couple of short stringers to blend the square profile to the first oval section and some small balsa gussets to fill the gap at the junction between the fuselage and the wing trailing edge. A bit confused but I hope that pictures would make the whole thing clearer
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Re: Me 109 e - D. Mc Hard
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Marco
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« Reply #43 on: July 03, 2016, 08:04:21 AM »

Here you can see the 'slot' I was thinking about.
I added a strip of balsa 1 mm thick/ about 2mm wide along the upper contour of the two central ribs. This should help to attach the tissue and to fill the gap between the ribs and the fuselage sides. The strip has a slot to accomodate the fuselage former and to help the alignment of the wing
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Marco
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« Reply #44 on: July 04, 2016, 04:30:32 PM »

...covered, finally....It took me a while to figure it out, but I am happy about the result of the blending between the trailing edge and the fuselage. The fillets should be the cherry on the cake
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« Reply #45 on: July 04, 2016, 06:35:55 PM »

Smooth covering job Marco. The client can start paying progress money now. Smiley

John
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Marco
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« Reply #46 on: July 10, 2016, 02:22:34 AM »

paint job in progress....this is the most exciting part for my customer
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« Reply #47 on: July 10, 2016, 05:13:00 AM »

Don't sneeze while you're painting the dark blobs Marco Smiley

John
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« Reply #48 on: July 11, 2016, 03:11:15 AM »

I've been following this Marco, very nice. I downloaded the plan last week and now I can understand everything in the earlier posts - the "Mystery of the Missing Wing Junction" and so on. I like the desert camouflage scheme - makes me think of sun and warmth!

Stephen (in wet, windy, cold, grey England).
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Marco
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« Reply #49 on: July 11, 2016, 03:39:43 PM »

John,  Grin

Stephen, here we are having one of the hottest summer of the last years.....
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