REARWIN SPEEDSTER 30" Dumas Kit 326 Flight Reports

[LASTWOODSMAN]

REARWIN SPEEDSTER  30" Dumas kit

NEW MOTOR INSTALLATION DONE        SATURDAY MARCH 23 2019

     Hi vtdiy.  Nope, I did not wash(?) the rubber motor, and I did not lube it.   I was just hoping to go with 300 hand winds (10 to 15 second flights?), a tight motor under tension holding in the prop block, and the plan was to never exceed 80% of the max "stretch winds", that I already experimented upon with all of my motors.   As far as break in stretching, apart from the stretch winding I did just now, for practise, yes I did pre-stretch them last season when I made them up.   I did lube a few,  but I find that it is not that much of a difference -  the lubed motors really make a mess of your tissue and especially the awful mess on the window glazing clear plastic.   Since I am just a small park flyer for fun and no record chasing (that is what we all 'like' to say), I don't think I will bother too much with lubing the rubber motors any more, just a pre-stretch.   But I will change the motors more often,  that is for sure.
        Well, here are the shots of the final assembly for any newbies out there.   Everything seemed to be going well ... so far...  Report (?) coming up ...

Pic #1     1744     Pull out the string, grab the rubber behind the Crocket Hook.
Pic #2     1745     Slip on the prop shaft hook through the small Crocket Hook hole (the string is through this hole also).
Pic #3     1746     Another view.
pic #4     1747     Cut off the string.
Pic #5     1748     Nestle in  the nose block, under rubber tension, into the front of the fuse.   Ready to fly, just by hand winds alone.  It does not actually take that long to put in 300 hand winds, if you have a solid enough nose to grip strongly with your other hand.

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard

[LASTWOODSMAN]

REARWIN SPEEDSTER  30"  Dumas kit

MOTOR BREAKS AT 275 HAND WINDS

     The Speedster did not even make it out of my hands     , on this futile attempt at a third flight report.  I must build a big model in the future, by figuring in a winding tube first of all ...
     On the first wind at the Cricket Wicket, on that perfect day yesterday -  2:00 PM sunny, 37 deg F (feeLs like 34), winds blowing from SW at 4 mph gusting to 7 mph, 38% humidity - Sat March 23 2019,  with the new (old from last year), 13" motor,  I worked my way up in winds stopping a few times, pulling out the rubber, checking the knots, stopped at 270 hand winds, then proceeded to put the last 30 winds in and SNAP   -  it was more shock and disbelief than anything ... as I really checked the rubber motor well beforehand ...   

Pic #1     1749     On the walk to try out the new  13"  motor.  Note the flag - only 4 mph from SW gusting to only 7 mph.  We were getting really excited ...
Pic #2     1753     Right in the middle of the pic - the gray oval of the breast of the Cooper's Hawk returning from last year.  Beautiful Spring day.
Pic #3     1755      Went home and got the 18" Air Camper - the wind really picked up - nose plant pose for a few seconds, before the wind finally blew it over.
Pic #4     1758     Wind driving it down.  The wind seemed to be staying near the upper limit of the gusts.
Pic #5     1752    Looking straight down the fuse at the broken cross members and the knotted ball of broken rubber motor.
Pic #6     1761     Another shot down the fuse at the broken crossmembers and knotted ball of loaded rubber ... The weather now at 3:40 PM  was 45 deg F (41), winds from West at 8 mph gusting to 17 mph, 33% humidity.

     The Speedster is now out of action.  Mandrake and Bloodroot will be very angry.       Surgery is necessary, as the broken crossmember, stabbing stub spikes from the broken crossmembers, will shred any rubber motor, that is  thrashing around in the fuse, as the rubber motor unwinds ...

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard

[LASTWOODSMAN]

REARWIN SPEEDSTER  30" Dumas kit

MOTOR BREAKS AT 275 HAND WINDS

Location:   Speedster Maintenance Hangar
Pics  #1 to #5   of  10

Pic #1     1764     Mandrake and Bloodroot pin up the old Ross Craftboard Fuse jig templates and pin them under the locating formers.  They are really upset at how much work there is to do now.   

Pic #2     1765     They start by cutting away tissue to get at that knot of wound rubber, using long, heavy duty, needle nose pliers, and trying to make sure on that first squeeze, because you know, if you only just nudge that sleeping snake by accident, it will strike out in all directions, trying to finish the job.

pic #3      1766     Banding down the fuse into the jig, with those elastics, was surely necessary, as the motor was fully wound.    I only pulled out the knot just a little with the pliers, and got my fingers on it right away, to pull it out, and start slowly undoing the winds.

Pic #4      1770     Tied down with elastics to ground pegs.   The crossmembers at Formers #7, #8, and #9,  need replacing or "doubling" up.

Pic #5     FOX SNAKE -  caught one of these when I was 10.   Six feet long and six inches in diameter -  let it go of course. 

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard
cont. on next post

[LASTWOODSMAN]

REARWIN SPEEDSTER  30" Dumas kit

MOTOR BREAKS AT 275 HAND WINDS
cont. from previous post

Location:   Speedster Maintenance Hangar
Pics  #6 to  #10   of 10

Pic #6     1769     The best way to get at the broken crossmembers was from above.  Once a couple of more tissue panels came off, there was enough room to see the actual damage, and see that it actually WAS possible to fix without having to take off the side decals and go in from the side.

Pic #7     1771     Examination from the top view.

Pic #8     1772     Top view.

Pic #9     1773     Mandrake and Bloodroot, cut and sand to shape, test fit, and sand again, three  3/32" square middle of fuse cross members.   Mandrake  is installing Fomer #7's crossmember.  Very tricky work.  Two are side glued as doublers, and one is glued on top  -  all upper surfaces are even.

Pic #10     1774     Here all three cross members are now double white glued into place.

     Now we just have to glue on tissue patches, and make up some brand new motors.

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard

[OZPAF]

The old Rearwin is a real battle horse. It never gives up . I know you have a narrow entrance at the front but I would be considering a flexible blast tube. It may be possible to roll a suitable one up out of thin plastic. Tape the seam together. The flexibility may allow it to deform enough to fit the opening.

Make it long enough to stick out the front of the fuse. You will need to use a length of wire between the rubber and the winder slightly longer than the tube for withdrawal.

I'm glad your workers didn't walk out when they saw the damage

John

[LASTWOODSMAN]

     Hi John and flydean1.  I have been shying away from the blast tubes.   I have read that they must be a larger diameter than the wound up, and knotted up, rubber motor, in order that the rubber motor can wind up freely, without the rubber motor rubbing up against the wall(s) of the winding tube.

      This fuselage is split horizontally, into top and bottom halves, by a "trough" or "shelf" of   1/32" square crossmembers, from the nose to the tail.   One thing I noticed about this model is how low the location of the rear motor peg hole is to this shelf - they could be positioned a little higher, as I have done with the new rear peg location support  plates, that are now forward one bay of, and higher than, the original rear peg location holes.    When I load up my motor pushing stick, with four strands of  3/16" rubber motor, and then slide the pushing stick into the fuse, right close to the shelf, it barely fits with the rubber around the "fingers" of the pushing stick,  barely fits into the height of that newer, and higher,  rear peg hole.  Now if I put a blasting tube in there too, where is the room for the blasting tube also?   Won't the rubber rub on the blast tube then?  being too crowded to the crossmember shelf?        If so, would I then have to raise the dowel holes higher?   Also, don't I need a little "press and turn" notch built into the end of the blast tube, to fit over the rear motor peg (dowel) ?

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard

[ironmike]

Ya gotta move on to another model man
and cut your losses

[LASTWOODSMAN]

I like this one.    It is especially good for practicing on.  Besides I see you guys flying a single model for years, and proud of it.   What have you got new for us IronMikey?   

[flydean1]

Sometimes all is needed is some long notches which allow you to slide the tube 1/2 inch or so behind the peg.  When I do that, I make a balsa wedge to push into the front opening to hold the tube while winding.

As you point out, if the winding rubber rubs on the inside of the tube, it isn't good.  As you unfortunately discovered, rubber is sometimes very unpredictable.

I had to repair my Lacey M10 about 3 times before I went to winding tubes.

[LASTWOODSMAN]

REARWIN SPEEDSTER  30"  Dumas kit

MOTOR BREAKS AT 275 HAND WINDS    COMPLETION OF REPAIRS

Hi flydean1.    How badly did you blow up the inside of the fuselage of your Lacey M10 three times?   Its good to know of other guys repairing blown up fuses also.   I am still wondering why the rubber motor broke in the first place     - all clean breaks on all four strands, four inches back from the Crocket Hook, and before that, all four strands broke right beside the Crocket Hook.   

Stayed up late last night finishing off the seven tissue panels I added (I am leaving the two right fuse side panels, at the rear peg, open for now to see the motor attachment (and to see  if it really flies any differently), and tying up a new four strand eleven inch motor, and stretching and lubing it.   The test run on 300 finger winds was 17 seconds.

I have put a lot of work in repairs, and reinforcing, of the wheels, landing gear, fuselage and wing, and wing struts.  With the current reinforcement planking of the upper Trousers and fuse, this is the best I can get it, in order to withstand those inevitable hard landings to a dead stop.   I have had 8 flights so far this spring, and the wire bends at the ankle (easily bent back), but I have had no hard landings yet to really test it.

And this morning is the time - 25 deg F at 9:30 AM with frost on the grass, and should warm up to 41 deg F by 11:00 AM  winds blowing at 7 mph.

Pic #1     1779     Mandrake and Bloodroot will not go quietly into the night, if they lose their jobs at the Maintenance Hangar.  They are stalwart tough Union Brothers.
Pic #2     1780     Seven new panels of tissue.
Pic #3     1783     All I have left is 14 feet of  3/16"  bubber after last year's first full season of flying the Speedster.     
Pic #4     1785     Assembling the motor.     
Pic #5     1786     Stretching and lubing the motor.
Pic #6     1791     Early morning sun - ready to fly ...   

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard

[LASTWOODSMAN]

REARWIN SPEEDSTER  30" Dumas kit

3rd FLIGHT REPORT     WEDNESDAY MARCH 27 2019

     As I was watching the weather this AM like a hawk, I saw the wind was now 11 mph    at 11:00 AM, and forecast to get windier, so off we went anyways to the Cricket Wicket.  It seemed way too windy, trying to hold the model for the walk out there.
     Weather  11:05  AM  37 deg F (30),  wind blowing from South at 11 mph gusting to 16 mph,  52% humidity.   We got in three perfect flights, launching downwind, and all circling to the left for 3/4 of a circle and soft landings slowed down into the wind.     250, 270, and 260 finger winds respectively and 14, 15, and 13 seconds of flight respectively.   Only little bends to the landing gear wire at the "ankle".   Easy to bend back.

Pic #1     1795     On the Cricket Wicket, would up with 250 hand winds.
Pic #2     1796     First flight going left.
Pic #3     1797     Second flight.
Pic #4     1798     Second Flight landing.
Pic #5     1799     Third flight low under the replicas, going left.
Pic #6     1800     Third flight landing.

     I thought the wind was getting stronger, so we left, and it looks like several days for better wind weather.   No damage to the Speedster ....  

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard

[OZPAF]

10 out of 10 for perseverance Richard I can see how being out there on your cricket patch is relaxing. A fair bit of space there and I'm amazed at how you keep avoiding all those trees. That's a good consistent trim you have on you Rearwin.

I'm all for repairing favourite models - I have quite a few in the sickbay waiting to get out

Happy Flying.

John

[vtdiy]

Anybody can build a model from new. Takes thought, skill, patience and imagination to repair and maintain a model, to fly, and fly again over the long haul. Good on you, Richard! I like the mature battle scarred look of your model. It's real, not a pampered poodle.

[stovebolt]

I like this one.    It is especially good for practicing on.

Stick with it young man, you only get 1 first. I'm still working on my first, but unlike you, I built one that won't fly. And have been told to scrap it and start all over. It's a low wing war bird, so when I built others, all I think about is ....the first. it's in it's third rebuild and I'm thinking it will fly, in a fashion.

[Crabby]

Richard, I have a 32 year old Comet Aeronca K. She's a battered old broad, tough as nails, and picky as hell but you give her what she wants and she'll do 2:00 easy. Get stupid with her and its all over. The Duco Guru told me years ago she was ready for the Mexican hat dance. The funny thing is.... she's the one doing the fancy dancing now! . Ha Ha Ha the Guru and Iron Mike always have these fancy young things to cut the carpet with. I got a few old broads who will flamenco in hell if I treat 'em right!    She was cannonized by the great one himself Earl Stahl!

[LASTWOODSMAN]

     Hi John.    Thanks for the bolster!    The Cricket Wicket (more round than oval  110 yards by 130 yards)  is a great place to fly, and just a ten minute walk to get out there from my apartment.  Just four days ago, the Cricket players have taken over the Cricket Field now,     from 5:00 PM  until dark, every day, so I must only go in there during the day.   Yes, it is hard to keep out of the trees.  You have to launch from more in the center of the field, with a buffer zone all around to the outer edge, and try to keep the model low (lower than the tree tops) and turning, and staying within that buffer zone.  Many times I have had wide perfect circles, flirting wide with danger, and when the rubber runs out, and the circle flight straightens out on the glide, and the plane goes sailing straight or curving slightly to the right, sailing right by the tree trunks    on the field perimeter, and of course also hitting the trees or the seating stands too  -   all this comes into play, when you play with fire like that.   Then you have all of the swirling wind sweeping through the large tree gaps in the perimeter  ...
     However  ...   If any of you are bored with flying in the still air of indoor facilities, there is lots of excitement flying outdoors in the real, unpredictable, wind.
     Hi vtdiy and stovebolt!  Thanks for the kind comments.   vt - the Speedster WAS a  "pampered poodle" when it was wasting away on the shelf as a static display model for three years, before I pulled it down out of its lonely misery, and brought it to life.  A lot of soul has been invested into this bird,  and I really learned a lot, first hand, from a very hard season of flying all last year.
     Hi Crabby!   Thanks for that pic Crabby - just how did Earl Stahl "cannonize" your 32 year  old Aeronca K ?   You have to tell me the wingspan, prop to rear peg length, what size motor and prop, and how many turns you put in to get 2 minutes    of powered flight.   "Mexican Hat Dance??"   I play that one too ...
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=Mexican+Hat+Dance+Attire&&view=detail&mid=53D25FF00C97A22EF30753D25FF00C97A22EF307&&FORM=VRDGAR

        By the way, I have 5, broken and smashed up,  "scale" bipes, and one EIII, all wasting away on the shelf right now.  They all took a few months each to build.  A real, discouraging disappointment, when you build them and they dont't fly.  Maybe someone can recommend a good flyable  30"  scale bipe laser kit - maybe one that has a "build in" compartment for the nose weight?     I am looking at other large high wing "flyable" golden age type scale models that are laser cut like the Speedster.   I like the looks of those planes, and they fly very well, and I need a big one with strong rubber,  for all of that wind.  And this wind today seems like it is always there now  -  no dead calm days ...
      So ... ,   I find great relief and great pleasure in just flying my 30" Speedster.  It actually has the penetration to fly in wind that is impossibe, and a waste of time, for smaller models.   And I like flying rather than building.   Plenty of time for static displays later on.   I defer to the old adage -  "Build what you want, fly all you can, and enjoy this great hobby."   So that is what I will do - fly this plane all I can.

Pic #1   Mexican Hat Dance Sheet Music and Speedster
Pic #2   Mexican Hat Dance pic

Thanks for watching

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard

[Crabby]

Earl Stahl was hanging around our bench at ETSU one year shooting the BS with Thee Olde Man, Dave Rees was stooging for me, and Doc Martin was timing. I don't know the ceiling at ETSU but it's up there. I was winding and Rees kept saying "keep winding". I did a ROG and the "K", only two (?) years old at the time motored all the way up to the ceiling and hit something up there knocking out of its pattern. It spun, recovered, then cruised for a few laps then came down for a beautiful landing not far from where we were standing. Earl crossed himself and I grabbed a felt tip pen and had him sign it. That's the story. I never ever have witnesses for my successes, but that day, a youngish old man had a few big shots watching.

That's the Comet Aeronca K floatplane kit, its like 25" wingspan....its here in the plan gallery. I use a single loop of 1/8" rubber 28" long probably about 1200 winds with a 7" testors prop. it weighs like 38 grams all rubbered up. The key is getting it up there on the prop run then getting a nice floaty glide back. I say 2 mins but that's outdoors and its probably a bit more. I don't use a winding tube, usually make two motors one gets wound to destruction so I am doing my best not to get a rubber explosion. Flydean would lose his mind watching my risky rubber antics!

I think that Speedster of yours has a surprise in store for you if you ever really wind the thing! I say let the old girl have her fun!!

[LASTWOODSMAN]

REARWIN SPEEDSTER  30" Dumas kit

4rth FLIGHT REPORT    FRIDAY MARCH 29 2019

     Great story Crabby    - please keep throwing them (and pics) up.
     Right after my above post, I was web surfing frolicking around a bit, and just happened to look at the computer weather -  it was  5:05 PM   48 deg F (46),  winds blowing only 6 mph from the East, gusting to 9 mph,  57% humidity  - WHAT !!??!!   -  we hurriedly grabbed the Speedster and some clay, and off we went to the Cricket Wicket, into the sudden calm before the storm coming later.   This was not in the forecast.      Gotta make the best of these chances.
     We ( me and my flight supervisor Trapper), had 8 quite well behaved flights and I am now quite confident to go to bigger motors and stretch winding.   But this was quite the perfect flying session, as I beat out the Cricket players to the Cricket field (maybe they were not coming tonight),  got in my 8 flights,  thought the wind was picking up (it really was getting less according to the weather), and felt a rain drop,  and decided to go home and not be too greedy.   No damage, and the landing gear is working fine so far,  absorbing those soft, into the wind, landings - with very little re-bending needed, if at all ...
      All flights, except the 8th  and the first, were 3/4 circle  to  1 1/4 circle. Longest flight was 19 seconds on 300 finger winds, Flight #5.

Flight #1   250  finger winds 12 seconds, launched from the SE into a crosswind East wind, which resulted in the wind holding the plane in a relatively straight line, very little left turn, and heading straight for trees, but the rubber ran out (good thing I started on low winds).  Launching directly down wind solved this.
Flight #2     260 winds  12 sec  launched more from the East, and got a perfect  left hand circle to a soft landing into the wind.
Flight #3     270 winds  14 sec same as above
Flight #4     280  winds  16 sec full perfect circle
Fliche #5     300 winds  19 sec  7/8 circle just floating into the wind about 7 feet high on final, rubber runs out, and it glides down to a soft landing again!   BEST FLIGHT of the day.
Flight #6     250 winds ( ??  lost count)  18 sec perfect also.
Flight #7     310 winds  17 sec   1 1/4  circle perfect landing.
Flight #8     330 winds ( getting greedy) - only 9 seconds, as the wind blew it down flying low and left, just above the ground, for half a circle, when it hit the high fluffy grass - no damage.

Pic #1     1809     Soft landing in thick grass, and posing in a three point nose stand - no damage.    
Pic #2     1811     Perfect soft landing - you can see the slight bend of the Landing Gear wire, right at the ankle on the left leg - this is where I bend it back straight by hand.
Pic #3     1812     Full circle flight and on its glide path down to a soft landing after the prop runs out -  see, the prop is still.
Pic #4     1814     One and one quarter circle flight passing through 360 degrees.  Whipping by and picking up speed with the wind.  BEST PIC the speed illusion.
Pic #5     1815     Fuselage window showing the "wound" rubber window, and Trapper.
Pic #6     1816     Storm clouds are moving in -  time to go.

Well, that's 4 flight reports, one big repair, and 19 flights so far, and the grass is not even green yet ...  great fun with the "Rearwin", as you guys call it.  

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard

[John Webster]

Some years ago there was a group build on the Small Flying Arts website from a plan for the Staggerwing Beech. Several people built the model and reported successful flights.

Recently it has been offered as a laser cut kit:
https://easybuiltmodels.com/pd15.htm

[flydean1]

I've heard great things about this kit.  Does anyone know of a kit or plans for a larger one, say 24 inch or slightly larger?

[Crabby]

you mean this thing? Rich Weber plan, and really is a great flier, but thrust adjustments are key! It is semi scale but still says it all.... I bet it would hold up to an enlargement. I don't get the laser cut thing on this model though, it really is a toothpick tree with the exception of a few ribs and some round formers up front! Great suggestion for Richard, another is the SE5a.

[LASTWOODSMAN]

Thanks for the suggestions.   I have already built a blue  17 1/2" Dumas Staggerwing laser kit #214,  Jan 3 2015.    43 grams total, and the nose cone itself weighs 3 grams.  No luck with this one -  just smashing in the balsa nose wall further into the plastic cowl, and no glide path - just straight down into the ground from 6  feet high.  6 second flights ...
     Dumas has a 30" laser cut Staggerwing for $67  US that they added to their lline on  Oct 17 2012.   Do you think a large 30" will fly better than a  17 1/2" model?

Pic #1     6132
Pic #2     6134
Pic #3     6137
Pic #4     6139
Pic #5     Dumas 30" Staggerwing

Here is the link to the STAGERWING 30" rubber power Dumas kit # 332

http://www.dumasproducts.com/product_info.php?products_id=1074

PS I like to fly with landing gear down ...

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard

[LASTWOODSMAN]

Look at this forecast!       Just biding my time, packing up the pack and windin stooge slowly, checking the list twice.   The Speedster has a new  16 1/2"  motor all lubed up and stretched ...      The kids are in school and no Cricket players ...   

Pic #1     Weather Fri Apr 5 2019
Pic #2     1841
Pic #3     1842

LASTWOODSMAN
Richard

[Indoorflyer]

That larger sized Dumas Staggerwing probably won't fly much better. It looks like a brick "outhouse" structurally, and is still not a very true to scale model. The Rich Weber dimescale design whether you scratch build or buy the kit is designed to fly, and is a proven performer. It has a very elegant, efficient structure. Molded plastic cowlings have no place on a flying model.

[Crabby]

Indoorflyer no speak with forked tongue! Him wise!