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Author Topic: Braided motors for a 16 inch span DCP DVIII?  (Read 331 times)
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steveneill
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« on: May 15, 2019, 11:02:40 AM »

I'm getting ready to start flying tests and made a 2 loop 1/8th rubber motor. The recommended motor by DCP was 2 loops of 1/8th. I'm thinking now that the braiding is overkill for this little plane.

So I'm planning next a non braided 2 loop motor and losing the crocket and replacing it with an o-ring.

Is braiding for this size molde overkill? I don't see it being done on many planes under 20 inches of span. This plane has a 16 inch span.

https://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l114/U-812/DVIII/IMG_0172_1.jpg

Thanks for any suggestions.
Braided motors for a 16 inch span DCP DVIII?
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Bredehoft
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« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2019, 11:23:36 AM »

I braid all* my motors.  *- excepting some indoor models where the rubber would still have minimal winds at touchdown.

Braiding helps lessen bunching of the motor at one end or the other.  Size of the model really is irrelevant. 

--george
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steveneill
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« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2019, 11:33:12 AM »

Thanks George. So when using 2 loops I thread the rubber through the o-ring twice through both loops before tying and braiding?
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VictorY
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« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2019, 12:15:18 PM »

Cut your rubber to length, make one big loop, put in some winds(maybe 10% or so), then fold the wound motor in half to get your two loops. Wind in the same direction as you normally would and the motor will stay taut even with rubber that is more than double the length between hook and peg. Here's a video if you care to see it in action. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7r61CkY2aQM

While I was browsing through it just now, he mentions that you may have to add more winds to the braid for scale models with short hook to peg distances. Watch the whole thing for all the valuable tips.
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steveneill
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« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2019, 12:43:32 PM »

Thank you for the video but I do know how to braid just fine. I was only wondering if it needed to be braiden at a smaller size. George answered that for me. Now I want to eliminate the wire crocket K made and replace it with a o-ring instead.
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steveneill
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« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2019, 02:19:21 PM »

More pictures of my finished model.

https://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l114/U-812/DVIII/DSCN4175.jpg

https://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l114/U-812/DVIII/DSCN4173.jpg

https://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l114/U-812/DVIII/DSCN4180-Recovered.jpg
Braided motors for a 16 inch span DCP DVIII?
Braided motors for a 16 inch span DCP DVIII?
Braided motors for a 16 inch span DCP DVIII?
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VictorY
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« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2019, 02:43:32 PM »

Thanks George. So when using 2 loops I thread the rubber through the o-ring twice through both loops before tying and braiding?

Sounds like a question to me. A question about building braided rubber motors. The video explains the easiest way to get two loops of braided motor, which involves braiding before doubling over so you don't have to braid two loops individually.
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steveneill
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« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2019, 03:16:41 PM »

Victor I did watch that and saw the way he does them both at the same time which is great. Thank you.
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calgoddard
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« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2019, 03:35:49 PM »

Steve -

That is a fantastic looking DVIII.  The paint scheme is awesome.  Your attention to detail is amazing.

I am worried about the lateral stability of your model.  The wing seems flat.  It should have a bit of dihedral.   The FAC rules specify a max amount of dihedral that is allowed for aesthetic reasons.

As presently configured, your DVIII would be prone to spiraling into the ground, e.g. when upset by a puff of air that puts one wing tip low.  

I recommend using the small Crocket hook from Volare for this model.  IMO, O-rings are best suited for an indoor duration stick model like a Limited Penny Plane or P-18.  With a Crocket hook you can insert a small rod, Allen wrench, or screwdriver through the rear hole which facilitates insertion of the prop hook through the forward hole.  There is less chance of the wound motor slipping out of your hand and damaging your model.  Get used to this routine as you will need to employ it on larger rubber powered models, like your Wanderer, where the torque on the "fully" wound, much larger rubber motor can really make it tricky to hold by hand.

Your videos on your FAC squadron website are excellent.
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USch
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« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2019, 03:59:26 PM »

I am worried about the lateral stability of your model.  The wing seems flat.  It should have a bit of dihedral.  


The DVIII might get away indoors without dihedral because the fuselage has a lot of lateral aerea. The same thing as happens with the often build LACEY M-10. No dihedral and they still fly. Another kettle of fish is flying outdoors with gusts and puffs from anywhere  Roll Eyes

Urs
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steveneill
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« Reply #10 on: May 15, 2019, 04:07:37 PM »

This DCP DVIII model on the plans recommends the dihedral you see in this plane. I asked about this before building and checked with Dave and a few other people. It's correct to the recommended dihedral on the plans which is 3/8's per panel. Glide test have been good so far powered is next at low turns.

I have lots of crockets however even with the small it's a bit tight in there but I'll try.

Thanks for the kind words.

Urs thanks for that!
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« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2019, 12:17:48 AM »

Steve, get out there and fly the thing! Please be sure and get some video! I am dying to see this Mona Lisa fly. My DVIII's were all flat on top and tapered on the bottom kind of like the real one. They were unstable outside except on the rare still evening....oh watch out for that axel wing... that can be a problem... (I found!)
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steveneill
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« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2019, 12:26:53 AM »

Thanks Crabby very much I will watch out for all those things. Much appreciated.
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lincoln
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« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2019, 04:53:07 AM »

Are you sure they said two loops and not two strands? Two loops sounds like a lot for a 16 inch monoplane unless the propeller is really large and/or the model is really heavy. I have a 22 inch twin pusher that's all sheet. The props are something like 8 inches in diameter and have a lot of blade area. I only use a loop of 1/4 inch on each side, but it climbs strongly anyway. I have an 18 inch Herr Cessna 180 that's kind of on the heavy side because I used the wood in the kit and didn't modify much of anything. With a 5.5 inch prop, I was using one loop that was a little less than 1/8" wide. (I'm spoiled, I have a rubber stripper.) BTW, the motor was braided.
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steveneill
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« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2019, 09:24:42 AM »

Lincoln I'll check the plans again but I'm pretty sure. It seems a bit much to me too. I had another problem yesterday too as the motor slipped off the crocket. Lucky there was no damage. I'm thinking I lubed the motor too much. I later tried it out of the plane on the stooge and watched it do it after it wound down. Weird.

BTW how do you braid a single loop?
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steveneill
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« Reply #15 on: May 16, 2019, 10:18:06 AM »

Never mind. I watched Josh's video again and at the end he shows how to do one loop. I also like how he winds the motors so you the bobbin goes through the two loops at the end rather than the crocket. If you don't want to use a crocket you can just load it onto the shaft and go.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7r61CkY2aQM&t=1290s

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steveneill
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« Reply #16 on: May 16, 2019, 10:21:47 AM »

I want to thanks Victor for pointing me to this video. I thought I had seen it before but Josh has so many videos when I actually watched it all the way through as Victor suggested I realized I had not. This has to be one of the best videos on braiding I have seen.
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« Reply #17 on: May 16, 2019, 02:05:05 PM »

Steve -

This is a follow-up on braiding single loop rubber motors.

One way to avoid having to tie and untie the small loops at each end of the segment of rubber is to use a pair of mini-sized Acco┬« clips.  These are springy metal clips with black jaws that you can clamp to the ends of the segment and then connect one of their chrome-colored arms to the hook of the winder.  You can purchase these clips from any Office Depot or Staples store.

Let us know how your DVIII flies.  Your model is a real beauty.

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Re: Braided motors for a 16 inch span DCP DVIII?
« Last Edit: May 16, 2019, 02:21:14 PM by calgoddard » Logged
steveneill
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« Reply #18 on: May 17, 2019, 12:17:44 AM »

Thank you so much for the kind words. I have many of those clips.
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