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Author Topic: Taipan 2.5 Gold Head glow  (Read 537 times)
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Fourfingers
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« on: August 31, 2019, 11:28:10 AM »

Can anyone identify the thread type for the cylinder head screws, please?
Roughly 30 x 3.2 mm.  Soft slot heads, to be replaced by capheads I hope.
The redoubtable Mr Duncan reckons they are M6 pozidrive .... surely not?
Have tried all my metric spares, nothing fits the thread.
Duncan was right about one thing, though, fantastic motor!
Thanks
ff
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Fourfingers
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« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2019, 12:47:16 PM »

Should have said ...about 40 threads per inch.
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3931bob
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« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2019, 12:09:10 AM »

Reviews says the head screws are 2.5M.6 Posidrive screws and strongly advise using a #2 Posi screwdriver.
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Fourfingers
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« Reply #3 on: September 02, 2019, 04:40:18 AM »

Thanks Bob
Mine have obviously been replaced at some point as they are mostdef slots!  Soft, too.
Never did get to grips with pozidrives - thought they had gone forever.
So,M6 posi is not the same as M6 metric .... nearest I could get from the measurements was 1/8" BSW.
More research needed methinks!
Ff
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qazimoto
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« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2019, 12:32:14 AM »

Thanks Bob
Mine have obviously been replaced at some point as they are mostdef slots!  Soft, too.
Never did get to grips with pozidrives - thought they had gone forever.
So,M6 posi is not the same as M6 metric .... nearest I could get from the measurements was 1/8" BSW.
More research needed methinks!
Ff

Possibly US 5:40 which are very close to 1/8" Whitworth. I'll check my Goldhead.

Burford was much more likely to use US threads than Metric.
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Fourfingers
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« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2019, 05:07:24 AM »

Many thanks Gaz
Woud be most interested in confirmation.  I can source UNC capheads OK here.  Another thread Ive never encountered before!
By the bye, my Goldhead seems extremely economical on straight 80/20.  Beautiful motor.
Ff
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greggles47
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« Reply #6 on: September 06, 2019, 10:56:12 PM »

Maria's book on Burford engines lists the head screws as 4-40. Yours may have been replaced by the larger 5-40.
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There must be some way out of here, said the joker to the thief,
There's too much confusion, I can't get no relief
qazimoto
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« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2019, 01:32:34 AM »

Yes, mine is 4:40 as well. This is an early metal backplate version not the plastic one. Anything is possible, thread change between batches, special job for Japan or the US etc. The only difference between 5:40 and 1/8" Whitworth is the thread angle, 60 v/s 55 degrees respectively.  Longer versions of Whitworth cap screws are like hens teeth but the 5:40 should be available in the model engineering supply dealers.
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Fourfingers
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« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2019, 11:07:46 AM »

Many thanks to all repliers ...
I have ordered some 1/8th UNC 40 tpi stainless bolts ...
Bet they dont fit!
John
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greggles47
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« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2019, 04:59:20 AM »

Many thanks to all repliers ...
I have ordered some 1/8th UNC 40 tpi stainless bolts ...
Bet they dont fit!
John

Well, did they fit?
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There must be some way out of here, said the joker to the thief,
There's too much confusion, I can't get no relief
Fourfingers
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« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2019, 07:14:32 AM »

Patience, Greggie, patience|

I ordered the wrong ones (4x40), and they didn't fit ....
5x40 now ordered and await Postie impatiently.  Good source at Accu.com.  Other suppliers are available.
you will hear it when I fire it up.
John
PS are these so-called 'intelligent' glow starter sticks worth buying?  Fed up with my regular ones discharging at improper moments.  I do have a 12v leisure battery.  Might be worth getting a panel for that.  Cox 049 especially hard on glow sticks for some reason.
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Fourfingers
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« Reply #11 on: October 12, 2019, 08:04:14 AM »

Finally .....
Got some 5/40 UNC capheads!  Westfield Fasteners have them.
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Fourfingers
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« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2019, 08:43:41 AM »

Hold the front page! ..... Contain your excitement.
My lovely A2 stainless 5/40, 1/8th cap heads UNC fit, but sadly not long enough!
Cant seem to find same tread any longer than one inch anywhere.
So ... any kind person out there has any spares?  They need to be 30 mm long excluding the head.
Any head -cap, posi, slot, X-head, dont care.  Preferably not mashed!
Will gladly refund P&P and a reward, say 2£€$ each whichever currency is more valuable! PM me if interested.
In hope, thanks
john
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cvasecuk
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« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2019, 01:35:09 PM »

Try here!!!  www.accu.co.uk/search?query=5-40 unc 1.1/4inch cap
Ron
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Fourfingers
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« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2019, 02:52:10 PM »

Thanks for that.  Did in fact try Accu and the right size woukd be a special order ." Much more than I could justify!
john
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cvasecuk
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« Reply #15 on: October 14, 2019, 04:06:28 PM »

Ah yes, didn't spot that!
Ron
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ffkiwi
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« Reply #16 on: October 14, 2019, 06:40:09 PM »

Sometimes I wonder about my UK brethren here-have ye no heard of modelfixings.co.uk?   Should be the first 'go to' source for most modelling related fasteners...and as for your 5-40 requirements well take a look here:

 http://www.modelfixings.co.uk/unc_cap_screws.htm          5-40x 1-1/4" are  5 for 1.60....so hardly extravagant...


Incidentally I just made the same type of discovery with a blackhead Taipan 2.5D I'm refurbishing for an acquaintance.....somewhere along the line they changed from 4-40 to 5-40 hold-down screws for cylinder retention....and yes I'm expecting some suitable replacement ones from Modelfixings in a matter of days....their mail order service is excellent-even to NZ...barely a week-so to you locals it ought to be almost 'by return'.....

 ChrisM
 'ffkiwi'

PS Their website is worth a thorough perusal-they stock some very useful items....thick repair washers with large ODs compared to the bore size (make good replacement prop washers! )....shim washers from 0.1mm to 1mm thickness (useful for taking up end float in traditional Brit plain bearing diesels) ,  replacement engine bearings,  o-rings etc....a lot more than just screws!!
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Fourfingers
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« Reply #17 on: October 15, 2019, 05:48:48 AM »

Chris
Many thanks for this site....never seen it before and I do keep my eyes open!  Perhaps they do not pay Goooogle enough to come in anywhere near the top in a search?
I have a long-held suspicion the web is not what it was, dark economic forces etc., but thats another story for another day.
So .... what a cornucopia of stuff, all very reasonable prices too.  I was in danger of paying more for head screws (for the Taipan, of course) than the engine itself.  Lost count of the ones Ive sent back.
Now, those knackered Rivers BA screws .....
Thanks again
john
Oh, nearly forgot- nearly all the helpful replies Ive received since posting here have beenfrom your compatriots.  I have had ggreat crack with Steve er... (he marketed all David Owen's collection) and got a superb Rivers S/S almost unused.

Also Kevin Howe ( a Gilbert and a Freebie 049 Frog glow, a delightful wee spinner.).  Alas, Kevin is not well, I send him every best wish.
jc
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Fourfingers
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« Reply #18 on: October 15, 2019, 05:50:43 AM »

Sorry, one omission: our cousins in USA, of course are more than helpful.
j
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Big G
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« Reply #19 on: October 15, 2019, 06:14:29 AM »

Model Fixings Ltd (and other useful companies) are listed on the main page of the Barton Forum - but maybe you don't go there.

Another excellent supplier of useful stuff is Cornwall Model Boats Ltd.

G
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Fourfingers
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« Reply #20 on: October 15, 2019, 10:41:27 AM »

And good old Blighty ... thanks big G!
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ffkiwi
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« Reply #21 on: October 15, 2019, 11:18:51 PM »

Chris
Many thanks for this site....never seen it before and I do keep my eyes open!  Perhaps they do not pay Goooogle enough to come in anywhere near the top in a search?
I have a long-held suspicion the web is not what it was, dark economic forces etc., but thats another story for another day.
So .... what a cornucopia of stuff, all very reasonable prices too.  I was in danger of paying more for head screws (for the Taipan, of course) than the engine itself.  Lost count of the ones Ive sent back.
Now, those knackered Rivers BA screws .....
Thanks again
john
Oh, nearly forgot- nearly all the helpful replies Ive received since posting here have beenfrom your compatriots.  I have had ggreat crack with Steve er... (he marketed all David Owen's collection) and got a superb Rivers S/S almost unused.

Also Kevin Howe ( a Gilbert and a Freebie 049 Frog glow, a delightful wee spinner.).  Alas, Kevin is not well, I send him every best wish.
jc

   Just to emphasise the point on Modelfixings.co.uk-the order for 5-40 screws (among other things) mentioned above has just been dropped in the letterbox-I saw the postman drop it off  from my kitchen window....ordered on the website 09 October, dispatched on the 10th, delivered here in  Wellington NZ 4pm on the 16th!   As I said earlier-their mail order service is outstanding!

  ChrisM
  'ffkiwi'
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Fourfingers
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« Reply #22 on: October 19, 2019, 12:04:37 PM »

I know, I know ... a minority sport- but nonetheless I must post to the bitter end ... (a bit like Brexs**t).
Thanks to Chris M the correct capheads arrived from modelfixings (other suppliers are available) ...
5/40 UNC.
BuT - and you oily fingers will know this - the heads of the screws are too wide for the hole in the cylinder head.
So, attack the screws or the head?  I can see pluses and minuses for both approaches.  Cylinder head soft, screws hard.  Screws cheap, head not. Attack head, originality gone. Also something of a diss to Gordon Burford, perhaps.
Need your support, guys - what do I do?  Tempted to leave the scabby slot heads in place and Loctite them.
j
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ffkiwi
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« Reply #23 on: October 19, 2019, 05:52:34 PM »

I know, I know ... a minority sport- but nonetheless I must post to the bitter end ... (a bit like Brexs**t).
Thanks to Chris M the correct capheads arrived from modelfixings (other suppliers are available) ...
5/40 UNC.
BuT - and you oily fingers will know this - the heads of the screws are too wide for the hole in the cylinder head.
So, attack the screws or the head?  I can see pluses and minuses for both approaches.  Cylinder head soft, screws hard.  Screws cheap, head not. Attack head, originality gone. Also something of a diss to Gordon Burford, perhaps.
Need your support, guys - what do I do?  Tempted to leave the scabby slot heads in place and Loctite them.
j

Can you reduce the OD of the head portion of the cap screw by grinding?.....I had a similar issue with the same acquaintance mentioned earlier with the Taipan 2.5D when he wanted work done on a CS Oliver...the replacement Philips head screws had too large a head diameter-I had to turn them down slightly to fit....the allen cap screws being hardened, would have to be ground down rather than turned....but if you lack a lathe you could probably do the job using a Dremel and a bench grinder....or just a dremel and a diamond file....

 ChrisM
 'ffkiwi'
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RolandD6
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« Reply #24 on: October 19, 2019, 06:02:30 PM »

They may not be fully hardened. I was interested in making a model 4 stroke engine some years ago and observed that a few other engine builders used black cap head screws as tappet adjusters. They used a ball end mill to change the hexagonal screw head socket into a hemispherical socket.

It may be possible to turn them down in a lathe especially if using a sharp carbide tool bit.

Paul
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