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Author Topic: Looking for Fairchild F.24 C8 drawings  (Read 1346 times)
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #50 on: January 19, 2020, 11:45:52 AM »

Looking at my last pic again, I think I mean I need a slightly shorter nose... which is not so good.
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Squirrelnet
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« Reply #51 on: January 19, 2020, 01:04:43 PM »

My thought, for what its worth, is that the FSI plans looks much more accurate than the scale drawing. I think your red outline my be a tad small and your blue centre line has a different gap between the line and the tail and the line on the plan. If you twist the red image slightly and enlarge slightly I think the FSI plan looks very close to my (imagined) eye.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2020, 01:36:37 PM by Squirrelnet » Logged
Pete Fardell
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« Reply #52 on: January 19, 2020, 02:40:13 PM »

Thanks Chris. If I can get reasonable accuracy just using the plan as is then I’ll certainly do that.
Can you just clarify what you meant by
your blue centre line has a different gap between the line and the tail and the line on the plan.
?
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Squirrelnet
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« Reply #53 on: January 19, 2020, 02:48:58 PM »

Just that the position of at the tail looks different between the plan and photo. The gap between the centre line and bottom of the TP is larger on the photo ? To my mind ( and I've never got the end of Martin Simons book !) that means you could rotate the photo clockwise slightly to achieve the same gap and find that the fuselage lines up much better  

Thinking about it more I think it actually makes the difference worse !!  Roll Eyes

What does strike me , is that if you enlarge your red outine from the photo and rotate it slightly it will fit the plan much more accurately. That may lose your reference ? the wing root? but the overall character of the aircraft is very close in the plan
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« Last Edit: January 19, 2020, 03:05:15 PM by Squirrelnet » Logged
Pete Fardell
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« Reply #54 on: January 19, 2020, 03:38:58 PM »

Thanks- I see what you mean now and find that all quite encouraging. I’ll mess about with the red outline and see if I can make it fit the plan better if I ignore my wing root reference. To be honest, it’s a fairly dodgy reference anyway, it being quite hard to see exactly exact where the LE and TE are on any of the side views.

If the eventual model matches the side view photo it shouldn’t then matter too much (from a judging point of view) if the side view on the 3 view drawing isn’t all that accurate. Should it?
« Last Edit: January 19, 2020, 04:10:42 PM by Pete Fardell » Logged
Pete Fardell
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« Reply #55 on: January 19, 2020, 04:22:21 PM »

Okay- just by enlarging the red fuselage outline by 105% I do indeed get a better fit, as you suspected. On this basis the plan just needs a little more of a sweep up to the tail and perhaps still a slight deepening of the cabin and I reckon it's usable.
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Squirrelnet
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« Reply #56 on: January 19, 2020, 04:36:43 PM »

That’s looking pretty close now

Quote
If the eventual model matches the side view photo it shouldn’t then matter too much (from a judging point of view) if the side view on the 3 view drawing isn’t all that accurate. Should it?

That’s my understanding. It’s judged against the photos , which in the this case are very good with the drawing as a reference if the photos aren’t clear so its very much secondary in this case . The best but more time consuming solution would be to amend the drawing and get ratified by one of the stc committee  so everything matches

As it is I would have thought that the drawing will not loose you any marks as the photos are so clear ?.... but what do I know Huh
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #57 on: January 19, 2020, 04:49:00 PM »

Yes, I'm sure it's always better to have a good drawing which matches the photos and is ratified. Discrepencies between drawing, photos and model are only going to make the judges' job harder, and so I suspect that whatever the rules say about photos taking precendent, a dodgy drawing will still lose me a few marks somewhere along the line.
That said though, I don't like re-drawing work, and I do like building and flying, so I'm probably going to build from a slightly modified FSI plan and only then tweak the 3 view if I get time and/or can be bothered. (Sorry, judges!)
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DHnut
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« Reply #58 on: January 19, 2020, 07:00:56 PM »

Pete,
       It is clear that there is no definitive answer with the information available. I have a book Fairchild 1926-1987 by Kent A Mitchell that has a piece on the C8-C8F and is states the later models were a complete redesign of the C8. There is a dimensioned 3 view of the C8A that gives a fuselage length of 23' 5" and a span of 35' 8" with U/C track of 9' 2". there are also some good side views but they may add to the confusion.
Ricky
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #59 on: February 21, 2020, 10:25:08 AM »

It's funny how things happen...
I'm still set on this Fairchild build but have been slightly sidetracked lately on the hunt for Bristol Prier drawings. In the June 1911 edition of 'Aeronautics' there is no Bristol Prier, but there IS this Fairchild monoplane 3 view!!

Ok, it's not quite the same plane as the F24 C8. I'm very tempted though! Haven't found a photo yet.

(I'm now in some danger of disappearing into a black hole where every proposed project leads to another propsed project, on and on forever into the infinity of time and space...)
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Squirrelnet
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« Reply #60 on: February 21, 2020, 02:35:45 PM »

Interesting Black hole to disappear down though !

I love these Edwardian designs, I might have to steal some of your drawings. I must dig out my book on early british aircraft, there were a few 3 views in that. I nearly started a 1910 Deperdussin project but I was , probably wisely, talked out of it due to stability issues. I do remember Alan Palfery flying one ff at Old warden in my youth so maybe it must be possible
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #61 on: February 21, 2020, 03:43:42 PM »

Funny you should mention the Deperdussin... On my Bristol Prier drawing hunt I came across this. A good bit more stable looking than the racier Deps.
A couple of other drawings I came cross too: a Thomas monoplane and a Dyott. All very tempting subjects to me. There are some nice photos to be found of the Dyott too. Feel free to steal away- it certainly won't stop me building them too.
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Squirrelnet
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« Reply #62 on: February 21, 2020, 04:27:56 PM »

Thanks Pete.

The Deperdussin I was looking at is the Shuttleworths example. It makes the Bleriot XI's short nose look very long !!! looking at the drawings 1910 was miss leading it's 1911.

This about about as far I got some 30-40 years ago,( see pic - I have loads of photos too ) might be worth resurrecting particularly as electric power with all the weight up front is so good now.

I wonder if the author of Aircraft Described in AM ever built or thought about building one Huh??



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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #63 on: February 21, 2020, 05:25:08 PM »

Go for it! I’ve got that big folded drawing too (as well as a similar one of a Caudron monoplane). The short nose on the Dep has certainly put me off. More like no nose at all in fact. Maybe you could mould the undercarriage skids from lead or gold or something? It is a lovely aircraft though.
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Russ Lister
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« Reply #64 on: February 21, 2020, 06:08:11 PM »

Veriheevium will work in the skids .... and I will win a Nobel Prize when I find it!  Roll Eyes
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billdennis747
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« Reply #65 on: February 22, 2020, 02:19:54 AM »

Gary Odgers made a big one, complete with nice brass tank, but his had a diesel engine in the 'nose', which helped.
I've just remembered having a 'discussion', as a judge, with a RC scale modeller with a pioneer model, who insisted he should get full marks for markings - there were none - because he had reproduced the absence of markings perfectly.
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Pete Fardell
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« Reply #66 on: February 22, 2020, 05:29:26 AM »

I've just remembered having a 'discussion', as a judge, with a RC scale modeller with a pioneer model, who insisted he should get full marks for markings - there were none - because he had reproduced the absence of markings perfectly.
Isn’t there some story about Mick Reeves persuading the Shuttleworth people to let him take a photo of a paper roundel lightly laid on their Bleriot just so he could the add it to his model and claim the markings points?
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billdennis747
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« Reply #67 on: February 22, 2020, 06:50:43 AM »

erm...yes it rings a bell!
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