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Author Topic: ezedope  (Read 357 times)
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sspresdavid
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« on: November 18, 2021, 02:06:48 PM »

How does a person get a good finish with ezedope? Do to housing and health issues, I am forced to hang up the nitrate dope. All suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

Dave
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TheLurker
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« Reply #1 on: November 18, 2021, 02:24:08 PM »

How does a person get a good finish with ezedope?
Luck, mostly.

Joking apart, a very soft wide brush and applying the 30% coat(s) very sparingly, 'cos it has a tendency to puddle.  Some people swear by sponge "brushes" rather than bristle to minimize streakiness.

You also need to be careful in your choice of tissue, it will need *some* wet strength.

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glidermaster
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« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2021, 02:50:29 PM »

I have limited experience with this stuff, and still prefer dope, despite the smell. However.........

There was a very informative exchange of messages and ideas between Peter Rake (well known in the UK) and Scigs who has contributed much here on HPA, and the pictures they provided showed very good results, but they did allude to considerable experimentation. I can't remember where that was, though  Sad

I found that, as Lurker said, tissue with wet strength is essential. I used Esaki, applied dry with tissue paste (wallpaper paste). I water shrank with a mixture of 5% EzeDope in water, applied with a spray bottle, drying overnight. Subsequent 'doping' was with 30% per Lurkers note, applied sparingly with a foam brush. I put 2 coats on for a pretty good result - sorry, I've lost the pictures, it was little sport rubber model. I haven't carried on using it, as my jar dried up completely, and then the price rose rather alarmingly. I noted also that it was a bit inconsistent - some bottles it was very thick, others much less so. I went on to experiment using water based acrylic sanding sealer, from the hardware store. To me, it seems to be a similar substance. I have covered a few models using that as 'dope' including the Keil Kraft Ace on the left of the picture. Over the years, however, the covering has 'relaxed' slightly, i.e. it is not as tight as it was originally. Not bad, though, the Ace was built 10 years ago.

John
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Jasco
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« Reply #3 on: November 18, 2021, 03:36:41 PM »

I have used the stuff and found it wanting. But....what I consider to be the delightful aroma of dope gives my wife migraines, so here we are.

I used a foam brush, diluted per manufacturers recommendation, "pre-misted" with a very dilute solution...and it still sagged and puddled.
Oh, and it will not double as an adhesive on undercambered wings. But it didn't smell, so I chalked it up to experience and moved on.

Fast forward a couple of years and I prepared to repair the same glider with EZ Dope.  I had used about 1/4 of the bottle on the glider originally, but the remainder was dried into a solid glob of ...whatever that stuff is.  Conversely, I've had the same quart of full strength nitrate sitting on the shelf for 20 years that came back to life with a little lacquer thinner.

Krylon spray works well on tissue. I've heard it referred to as "magic in a can", but be careful! IT'S HEAVY!
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calgoddard
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« Reply #4 on: November 18, 2021, 07:08:24 PM »

sspresdavid -

I have had good results using Eze Dope on Esaki tissue. The smell of nitrate dope is verboten in my household.

Some of my mentors are absolute masters at covering with tissue and nitrate dope. I wish I could emulate their skills. The tissue on their models is tight and it has a beautiful nice sheen.

I don't build Peanuts but mostly models with 18 - 34 inch wing spans. Usually I can get them to fly pretty well. I have built a few coupes with larger wing spans. I am not a great scale builder because I am not an artist and lack the patience for all the detail - wire stays, rivets, exhaust marks, machine guns, etc. However I love to look at the stick and tissue scale masterpieces built by others, and really enjoy seeing them fly.

Esaki tissue is no longer being manufactured. A number of posts on HPA indicate that there other brands of tissue that are commercially available that have similar strength and weight.

I do not pre-shrink the Esaki tissue.  I affix it to the balsa wood frames with a 50/50 mixture of white glue (Elmer's) and water. Let the frames dry over night. I have not had good results with glue stick. I apply the tissue with the slick side down.  The grain extends lengthwise on the fuselage and span wise on the wing and stab.  This way the tissue imparts torsional strength to the fuselage, wing and stab when it shrinks.

Shake the Eze Dope bottle well.  Make a 30/70 mixture of Eze Dope and water. Shake the mixture well. Apply it to the tissue with a soft, wide artist's brush. One coat is all that is needed.  

The tissue dries fairly taut and the finish looks reasonably good.  It does not look as nice as the finish achieved with thinned nitrate dope.

I find that I get tighter tissue and less wrinkles if I don't pre-shrink the tissue.  Eze Dope is odorless and the flying surfaces treated with that liquid resist warping when I transport my models between humid and dry climates.

Here is a picture of my Three Nite P-30 with red and yellow Esaki tissue that was shrunk and finished as described above. No warps have been detected in the wing or stab of this model even though it has traveled from humid sea side conditions to desert conditions.

There may be increasing difficulty in purchasing nitrate dope and nitrate dope thinner in the future. I would anticipate problems shipping these liquids.  

You can purchase Eze Dope on Amazon.

Enjoy our hobby, whatever covering technique suits you.
 


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Jasco
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« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2021, 08:26:46 PM »

All of my negative bellyaching about EZ Dope aside, like any new process, practice will improve results, I am sure. The finished result does look very nice and has a nice sheen on the surfaces I was successful in applying it. (The stab and most of the fuse look pretty good)
That was the first model I had covered in about 20 years and the rest of my skills were rusty, too.

I've had the plane out in some quite damp conditions and the tissue will sag after a while, but water beads nicely and nothing has warped.

The thumbs down comes from the poor (imho) shelf life.
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TheLurker
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« Reply #6 on: November 19, 2021, 03:32:48 AM »

Quote from: Jasco
The thumbs down comes from the poor (imho) shelf life.

How long did it take for your bottle to go "off"?  The bottle I have is about 4 years old and shows no signs of curdling, yet.  I have a vague memory, possibly from the Peter Rake/SCIGS exchange mentioned above, that it was reformulated to deal with a number of problems the original mix had.

I too prefer the finish one gets with cellulose & nitrate dopes, but I like being able to work in a nice warm house without gassing MrsL so its limitations are a small price to pay for that privilege.
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sspresdavid
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« Reply #7 on: November 19, 2021, 07:40:12 AM »

Thank you all for your advice. I am currently using Ezebilt tissue because 1, my Esaki supply is running low, and 2, it came with the kit. It has some wet strength, but not much. Esaki it ain't! I use UHU glue stick to attach the tissue and have always had good results, even with polyspan. I had reasonable results on a test panel using an airbrush, using 30% eze dope an water. Today is D day (dope) and I hope to have some results by tomorrow.



Dave
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Jasco
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« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2021, 09:48:01 AM »

Man, that's a great looking bird!  Someday I'll get over my fear of Cox and try a gassie.
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sspresdavid
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« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2021, 10:48:05 AM »

It's a .020 diesel and it is easy to handle and very easy to control power.
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sspresdavid
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« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2021, 06:47:56 PM »

2 Light coats, diluted 30% ezedope and 70% water, applied with an airbrush and so far it looks OK. A few warps showed up on the wing and horizontal stabilizer, but I'll give it a couple of days to really dry and will then steam them out. I am reasonably satisfied with the results. For me it's  "the only game in town" so I guess I will have to get used to it.

Thanks again for all your help since it pointed me in the right direction. If you have an airbrush, use it.

Dave
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TheLurker
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« Reply #11 on: November 20, 2021, 02:58:20 AM »

Quote from: sspresdavid
If you have an airbrush, use it.
If you haven't, then a pump action spray - if the mist is fine enough - works quite well for the 30% coat(s) as well as for applying the 5% shrink/strengthen coat.  I've used this solution (sorry) on Al/Ag tissue where the action of the brush combined with the water would lift the Al/Ag flake from the tissue.
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sspresdavid
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« Reply #12 on: November 20, 2021, 07:15:06 AM »

A fine mist pump sprayer would be a good option and I will try it the next time to save me from the tedious cleanup of the airbrush.

Dave
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