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Author Topic: A thanks to all!  (Read 587 times)
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justwantin
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« on: March 04, 2011, 07:58:35 AM »

I have over the past few weeks have developed the urge to construct an HLG. In my teens several friends and I built and flew Thermic 18's 20's and B's thanks to one of the fathers who taught us how make and fly them. I had allot of fun and even stuck a Jetex 50 on a couple. I did some stick planes too but never touched em again afterward except for once five years ago when I wandered into a shop, purchased some balsa and glue and had a go from memory. Looked nice but didn't fly. No wonder!

I googled across this forum last night and have learned so much. I always built quick and worried how it would fly later. This time with the info provided in this forum, as well as on some other sites, I'm sure I'll do a better job of it.

Thanks!
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-John-
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« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2011, 11:44:14 AM »

Build a Tip Launch Glider! Performance is astonishing, and it's not to difficult to learn to throw.

John
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Zeiss Ikon
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« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2011, 12:58:54 PM »

There are free plans around for the Thermic Trio -- that gets you, IIRC, a Thermic A, Thermic B, and Thermic 18 (or something similar). Nothing like competitive designs for modern contests, but they fly well enough to lose one in a thermal occasionally.
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Big Paulie
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« Reply #3 on: March 12, 2011, 02:08:13 PM »

I googled across this forum last night and have learned so much. I always built quick and worried how it would fly later. This time with the info provided in this forum, as well as on some other sites, I'm sure I'll do a better job of it.
Thanks!

When I got back in to FF a few years ago -- the first time since the advent of the internet -- the people in here and in Small Fying Arts (which are basically the same group of posters) were (and remain) incredibly supporting and informative. Even the most competitive flyers will share whatever they know to help the novice and intermediate FF'ers along.

The generosity, vibe and level of knowledge is unsurpassed!
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justwantin
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« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2011, 06:26:16 PM »

I have purchased some materials and acquainted myself with working with balsa epoxy and Ca. I grew yup with Ambroid. Tried shaping a wing as per a thread in this forum and am somewhat satisfied but I need to find a local source for decent quarter grain of reasonable density as the wing I shaped is IMHO way too soft to be worked properly.

I'll worry about making something that flies later, I dropped instant gratification a while back.

Question: can corn flour be substituted for talc when making sanding sealer from dope?
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Tmat
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« Reply #5 on: March 14, 2011, 07:23:02 PM »

I'm not sure if flour is a suitable substitute for talc. But why are you using sanding sealer in the first place? Many of us (including the experts around here) don't use dope for hlg/clg flying surfaces anymore. We use Minwax Spar urethane varnish as it offers many advantages over dope.

Have you tried getting balsa from Peter Lloyd (Pelaero): http://www.pelaero.com.au/
He sells good wood in Australia and is a very good hlg/clg builder/flyer/designer that could help. He also sells kits, timers and other goodies.


Tony
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Zeiss Ikon
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« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2011, 07:31:26 PM »

A while back when I was flying model rockets, I learned about a really nice balsa filler that adds very little weight: Elmer's Fill 'n Finish Lite Wood Filler (get only the "Lite Wood" variety; the other kind is rock hard and heavy). This material can be thinned like paint, and at the consistency of pancake batter will brush on, fill the surface of your wood, and can then be sanded down until you start to see wood fibers. At that stage, I used to apply two or three coats of spray primer and wet sand, followed by color coats, for a finish that looked like molded plastic or fine auto body work, but all that paint does add weight; for gliders, that'd be the point at which you'd seal with one or two coats of thinned dope.

Key to the lightness of the Elmer's product is that it's mostly water when applied, but then the water evaporates away, leaving a porous structure that's stiff enough to stand up, but mostly air (this is similar to the making of an aerogel, only much less extreme). Sanding sealer, by contrast, will fill your grain with a solid mixture of dope solids and talc (or balsa dust, or whatever you use) -- it'll add two or three times the weight, as well as requiring multiple coats over multiple hours instead of an hour or so to apply, dry, and sand.

As an added bonus, Fill 'n Finish Lite Wood is almost the same color as balsa, so it's very unobtrusive, unlike the pasty white of sanding sealer.
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sweepettelee
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Simplicate & add more lightness. Keep sanding!



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« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2011, 01:56:17 PM »

Hi 'justwantin'! And welcome from the HPA Glider Gang!

I am glad Tony told you about PLloydie down in Melbourne and his good goodies. I am a bit surprised he didn't send link to jAn Langelius' website, so here it is: DiscUSKid.com There are plans of top TLGs and the best thing of all, Stan's Stuff products listing! Many [most?] of the top HLG & CLG fliers that I know use Stan's kits and related products.

Tim Batiuk holds the AMA HLG record of over 45:50. That is nearly 23 maxes! Tim uses Stan's  kits, wood, CLG and TLG body setups exclusively... because they are the current State of the Art. Stan now ships abroad FYI, so you can get his Stuff in OZ, as well.

Leeper
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Leeper
justwantin
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« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2011, 02:52:56 PM »

Quote
But why are you using sanding sealer in the first place?

That's what I learned when I was a kid, sanding sealer, sand smooth, then 2 coats dope, light sanding lighter sanding. Back then we could purchase sealer. I read talc could be used to make a sealer. Last time I used dope alone it was raise the, grain sand it off each coat for several coats. Sealer seemed to take care of the raised grain first coat.

I've been thinking about having a play with shellac and then water base polyurethane or just the polyurethane alone. I use orange shellac and wb poly on my Japanese and on lantern frames. Seems very lightweight but I haven't any way to quantify that statement. I like the "pumpkin" effect too... adds a bit of age.

Quote
Have you tried getting balsa from Peter Lloyd (Pelaero): http://www.pelaero.com.au/

I've noted Peter Lloyd on the forum and had a look on his website. He's been on my mind as a source but I'm self employed and do my hobby activities in spurts between busy periods when I have the mad money.
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Tmat
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« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2011, 03:02:18 PM »

As I mentioned, the sanding sealer and dope finish is now old school. You can certainly still do it and by all means do whatever turns your crank! But the wipe on poly finishes stay flexible, are waterproof, resist warping and don't smell like dope. Color can be added with Design Master Floral spray (probably the lightest rattle can paint going) available from Michaels craft stores in North America.

Tony
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justwantin
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« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2011, 03:32:15 PM »

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But the wipe on poly finishes ... <snipped>

So I take it that Minwax Spar urethane varnish is a wipe on paste like product
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sweepettelee
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Simplicate & add more lightness. Keep sanding!



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« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2011, 03:52:36 PM »

Aux contraire mon ami, think spar vanish... thinable with good mineral spirits or paint thinner, plus what Tony did not say: it is highly UV resistant.

I prefer oil-based polyurethane spar varnish, aka Minwax brand in USA. Look for similar stuff down under! Some guys have used water-based, as the oil-based stuff was not available in their locales [environmental restricted].

Not sure of their success rate. Your results may vary. Wink

Leeper
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Leeper
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