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Author Topic: Capacitor Sport  (Read 8071 times)
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julio
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« Reply #25 on: January 02, 2015, 06:23:37 AM »

Frash

Thank you for your data and links. I will read carefully all the available material.

I'm thinking in direct drive. Have been looking for light gears in my country but only got some plastic robust ones (not for this aplication).
In the case of small connectors I have in mind recycling some old computer items with tiny connectors. Will see...

Thank you so much!

Julio
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raggedflyer
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« Reply #26 on: January 02, 2015, 11:37:41 AM »

Correction

Calculator finger became evident when studying other films!

Covering material

My first laser cut depron models were covered with Solarfim SoLite, which is an excellent product but weighs ~20 - 25g/m2 and is available in clear and colours. The coloured films are heavier than clear. For my original all balsa fuselage / depron wing models it is very suitable but over time and as I have learnt through experience by trial and error how to lighten the designs SoLite is no longer appropriate because of weight and (high) shrink rate. The weight is due to the film gauge, material type and the adhesive coating all over. I note that Solite is also listed as being polypropylene, which is a useful clue.

I fly with some fellows that have far greater indoor experience and they use OS film but in the UK it is listed as £28 for 25ft from Free Flight Supplies, so not a sensible choice for me at this stage. My immediate need is satisfied by my particular source of ‘Bag film’ although I would like to establish exactly what that material is. As I said, my ‘Bag film’ weighs ~4g/m2 and 10 layers measure ~ 0.06mm which equates to ~ 6 microns (~0.0002”) for a single film layer. That equates to ~0.2g covering for a model of this size.
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PeeTee
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« Reply #27 on: January 02, 2015, 11:53:05 AM »

Quote
they use OS film but in the UK it is listed as £28 for 25ft from Free Flight Supplies, so not a sensible choice for me at this stage

Bear in mind that Mike (FFS) also sells 1 and 2 micron film at £5 for 5 metres which is considerably cheaper and likely more durable for the type of model you are flying. All this (and more) can be found on the FFS website.
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raggedflyer
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« Reply #28 on: January 02, 2015, 02:01:41 PM »

Thanks for that info PeeTee.

I have tried 5 micron clear mylar and silvered mylar of about the same weight but didn't get on with either. My experience was that mylar didn't shrink as well as 'bag' material at a low temperature and remains somewhat crinkly when applied. Comparing the density of mylar vs polypropylene initial indications are 1.39 vs 0.90 g/cm2 respectively, or expressed another way pp is about 65% the weight of mylar for the same thickness. Mylar has the advantage of being available in several thicknesses less than (my) 6 microns though but perhaps a thinner pp is out there somewhere?

I've not found durability to be an issue at all using ~6 micron 'bag' pp for indoor models. I have several that have done a couple of seasons with no deteriation.
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raggedflyer
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« Reply #29 on: January 12, 2015, 11:22:32 AM »

iyi – SC flown again at yesterday’s indoor sessions and it now trimmed out very well.

Initially the adjustable all flying small sub fin could only provide barely enough left turn for our hall size. This was improved after the first session by including an inboard drag plate on the left wing panel (as used successfully on the aVa - R, a V - tail rubber design). The sub fin of the Y - tail is now almost back to neutral, only just slightly left. Perhaps I’ll make the sub fin part fixed on the next variant to simplify the tail end of the boom.

I presume it’s correct to refer to this as a drag plate rather than an aileron as the intention is that it should only rise to destroy lift?

Now a couple of questions that hopefully someone can answer pertinent to Hobby King Product ID 527000001-0 as I observe a significant difference in performance between 2 examples…..   one has much longer and vigorous performance than the other when charged from the same charger pack to the same level.

1.   On the 6mm pager motor one has Red & Green wires and the other Red & Blue. Do the wire colours relate to motor winding resistance?

2.   Is the SuperCapacitor notionally 5F or 10F?

I note that typically this type of electronic component can have a –20% / +80% tolerance
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Re: Capacitor Sport
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raggedflyer
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« Reply #30 on: January 16, 2015, 11:20:43 AM »

iyi - SC flying on second outing - a little close to the stall on this particular flight but soon rectified.

http://youtu.be/H5HPlewgnic
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scrubs
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« Reply #31 on: March 17, 2016, 11:07:39 PM »

Hey Fred,
Any updates on your capacitor stuff?

bill
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lincoln
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« Reply #32 on: March 18, 2016, 12:52:55 AM »

Earlier in this thread, the weight of covering film was discussed. Recently I weighed an HDPE vegetable bag from the supermarket. It's marked HDPE for recycling purposes, though it's so light that I'm suspicious the recycling would use more oil than making a new bag. It's one of those bags that's just slightly cloudy. It worked out to about 5 grams per square meter, more or less. That's a lot lighter than Esaki or I think even Gampi tissue. The lightest Esake I've seen is maybe 10 grams per square meter, and typically it's a couple of grams more.

The specific gravity of HDPE is around 0.95. That works out to a film just over 5 micro-meters thick, or about 0.0002 inches. If I recall correctly, the really serious film for indoor models is something like 0.000035 inches, or about 0.9 micro-meters. It's mylar, though, so it's significantly heavier. About 1.2g per square meter, I think. I thought it would be lighter before I calculated the weight. This stuff clings to itself viciously, and it's easy to tear while cutting, unlike the much heavier HDPE bags. Takes glue better, though. This is beginning to get thin enough that there are bands of color based on variations in the thickness. My understanding is that really thin transparent stuff like this can act as a color filter. I think the fancy model mylar is still a few times thicker than "microfilm", formerly used by the most dedicated indoor modellers. Microfilm is a mixture of nitrate lacquer or dope, thinner, plasticizer, and a little eye of newt, poured out on water. I haven't seen any for a long time, and never saw much of it, but it's beautiful. Impractical, I think, for models of the type we're discussing here.
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scrubs
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« Reply #33 on: October 11, 2016, 09:39:03 AM »

I see Stevens Aero is now selling a capacitor kit and matching plane. But I can buy a timer for what they are charging!

bill
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Dayhead
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« Reply #34 on: July 10, 2017, 05:19:10 AM »


  I recently bought two Air Hogs brand "E-Chargers" planes at a Target store. The little Delta wing planes flew well, although I didn't like the foam used for the wing. I have removed the power units and will make a simple test stand for my gram scale, taking care to ensure that the scale won't feel Mr. Bernoulli's presence.
  These power units are lighter than the E-Charger units from a few years ago. It uses a direct drive pager type motor, the older style used a heavier motor and had a gear box and larger prop. With those units my 18" span balsa and foam planes covered with tissue could get up to 50' and duration was about a minute. At the time, I felt that the power units were roughly equivalent to a 9" loop of 3/32" rubber, that is, the same airframe turned in very similar flight times using either the rubber motor or the cap powered E-motor.
  I have never tried to post a photo on the internet. I will take photos but I'm scared of trying to do anything with a computer because every time I've tried I crashed the thing. Maybe I can find some young whippersnapper to help me. But in the meantime I can recommend these new E-Charger planes.
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herreraa
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« Reply #35 on: April 19, 2018, 02:52:05 PM »

I want o build some models and used a 5F and 10F supercapacitors. I already have purchased the capacitors.
Can anybody advice how can i measure when capacitor if fully charged. I do not want to use the guideline of maximum 10 seconds . But i want to used a multimeter to measure the charge. However , I do not know how to connect it with a multi-meter and what to actually measure in the super capacitor.
Any advice is greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Alex
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PaulBrad
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« Reply #36 on: April 19, 2018, 11:11:34 PM »

Use your multimeter to measure the voltage across the capacitor. When the voltage reaches the voltage of your source or the rated voltage of the capacitor, it is fully charged. Charging above the rated voltage of the capacitor will shorten its life, and if the difference is too much, the capacitor can pop. A small amount of over voltage is not a big issue, just shortens the life of the capacitor.

Paul Bradley
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