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Author Topic: Show us your P-30's  (Read 61737 times)
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Alexandre Cruz
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« Reply #250 on: August 18, 2010, 10:49:22 AM »

 Jim,

 I am glad you liked the Saturno V3 it is really a good climber, during Argentina nats it outclimbed all other models. It is hard to use the torque peak but if you launch correctly ( I launch left and strongly) the model will do a small vertical climb and transition to the spiral climb (right-right pattern) that shall give you some extra height. I fly using six 1/8 strands but I was beaten in Argentina by my own design using four 1/8 strands. It works well but climbs slowly, quite dangerous to drop a max it think. My best time on dawn is 2:35 using the six strands set-up.

 Concerning weight, I also do not think 40g is too light. Brazilian wood is heavy (Jim can second on that) 160kg/m^3 or more and the model weights 39g ready to fly with viscous timer. It least here nobody had left flying P30 or not entered due to weight problems...
« Last Edit: August 18, 2010, 11:06:30 AM by Alexandre Cruz » Logged
Tmat
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« Reply #251 on: August 18, 2010, 11:37:01 PM »

Here is a few pictures of my 8 year old nephew Jack with a Starlink "Pirate" P-30. It has a Dave Burley PST 1-function electronic timer, an Airtek (Ken Bauer) RDT receiver and a tracker bug from Pim Ruyter. Pop-off wing DT (Jack thinks that's so cool!) and a Czech prop. Powered with 6 strands of 1/8" super sport. Jack really likes the Gizmo Geezer winder with the electronic counter (and so do I!). By the way, Uncle Tony made a special aluminum half tube for the P-30 so that it could be wound outside of the airplane just like his F1B's! Works flawlessly.

The photos were taken at a recent meet at Base Borden in Ontario. It was quite windy and the Pirate flew like a champ in the wind. We waited for a lull and Jack made excellent launches and had very good flights. He took first place in the 10 gram Open Rubber event.

I'm getting him a Coupe for the next contest!

Tmat
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crashcaley
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« Reply #252 on: August 19, 2010, 09:20:46 AM »

Tony, What a nice Uncle you are. Nice to see youngsters still interested in what many consider too low tech. Gee, if the majority of people only knew how complex some of these models can be. Way to go Jack! on your win.

Caley
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Tmat
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« Reply #253 on: August 19, 2010, 10:22:45 AM »

Jack certainly enjoyed the whole experience Caley. Base Borden is still an active Canadian military base, so that in itself was very cool to him. I took him to the excellent military museum on the base (I've been going to Base Borden for 30 years and had never been!) and he was thrilled to be able to see tanks and amphibious vehicles up close. He loved the flying, but the chasing was a bit tough (some flights went 1.5 km!). Next time we are going to bring his ATV so that he can chase himself!

And his P-30 is pretty high tech!

Incidentally, I've ordered a 2 function E-timer for my next P-30. For breezy conditions I want to use all of the initial torque for a vertical burst.

Tony
-yeah, I'm an F1B guy.....
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crashcaley
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« Reply #254 on: August 19, 2010, 12:07:53 PM »

Yeah, You F1B Guys have me scratching my head on how all those gizmos work. Looks too complicated for me, especially when I've an electronic timer that I still cannot figure out how it works. Looks like you and the youngster will be a good one, two punch at comps. Smiley

 Caley
 Mmmmm, was just thinking who'll be #1 Grin
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Tmat
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« Reply #255 on: August 19, 2010, 01:14:55 PM »

Yeah, me too! Grin Little guy has no fear. Now I have to teach him patience with air picking. He just wants to throw it and see it fly.

You know Caley, I got into electronic timers because they were easier to use in the field. Hook up the line(s), turn it on and throw. No winding of springs, no counting of scrolls or timing the timer to see where 2 or 3 minutes is, dead accurate DT times (and DPR times for F1B/G) and the RDT capability is just super important for flying sites with lot's of plane eating hazards like trees and crops. The toughest part is the battery management. Learning how to care and feed the little Lipos was not was I was used to. Fortunately, the youngsters these days grow up with small electronic devices and so have no trepidation regarding the hardware. It's easy and cool for them. Older folks find it daunting for sure.

What electronic timer do you have Caley?

Tony
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crashcaley
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« Reply #256 on: August 19, 2010, 03:04:45 PM »

The time is a Z-TRON for my Tomboy. Too much for anything else. I think you have to have a brain that thinks in binary. I've read the instructions, and the math is what's stumping me. I can do regular math, but don't throw anything else at me.

The little guy sounds like me. I'm pretty close to being able to wind a motor properly, but have no patience for waiting around to find good air. I don't want my models flying very far or high anyway. Thermal finding is for people who like competition, and a desire to say, "Look, I beat you."

Look forward to hearing more about his participation in our hobby.

Caley
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BG
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« Reply #257 on: August 19, 2010, 10:21:29 PM »

I just want to beat myself Grin Grin
B
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crashcaley
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« Reply #258 on: August 19, 2010, 10:32:11 PM »

Bernard, You're like myself. Compete against what I've done before.  Smiley

Caley
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applehoney
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« Reply #259 on: August 19, 2010, 11:51:22 PM »

Quote
a desire to say, "Look, I beat you."

I've never heard anyone say that in 60+ years of competition flying; I doubt it's even come to mind!
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crashcaley
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« Reply #260 on: August 20, 2010, 09:05:22 AM »

Sorry Jim, You're correct about the people in our hobby. Never seen that in the short time I've been in it. But unfortunately, I've seen it in other activities. Makes me sick to see people who act that way. Thank goodness there are still activities that are done in a gentlemanly manner.

Caley
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Tmat
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« Reply #261 on: August 20, 2010, 09:53:49 AM »

Gentleperson?

Grin
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MartinR362
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« Reply #262 on: September 04, 2010, 06:34:06 PM »

I use a simple "Grammi?" system developed in the 1930's in the UK.

The attached picture should help.

Marty
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applehoney
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« Reply #263 on: September 04, 2010, 06:56:12 PM »

"Garami" .. attributed to Louis Garami, USA, in the 30's Legal to use by UK P30 rules but in N.America all you can do to a prop is add weight for balance and bush the hub. Lashing on a Garami is a no-no - hence clutches attached to the shaft, the ramp on the prop is unreliable and soon wears down anyway.
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Dave Sechrist
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« Reply #264 on: September 04, 2010, 07:45:19 PM »

TMat Where did you get your e-timer? I have been thinking along the same lines that auto functions would be an asset on p-30 when flying in windy conditions.
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MartinR362
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« Reply #265 on: September 04, 2010, 09:56:32 PM »

That's what I did, added weight and bushed the hub. I recall when clutches were "banned", now legal I guess. The system is used by others and I have never been called on it in over 20 years.

Marty
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applehoney
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« Reply #266 on: September 04, 2010, 10:52:49 PM »

Interesting. I'm not sure if clutches attached to the prop were actually banned in the early rules but no mention now ... Garry Hunter would know, he was there at the inception of the class

"Only the following changes will be allowed: 1.4.1. Flashing may be removed. 1.4.2. Balancing by the addition of weight to one blade will be allowed. 1.4.3. Enlarging the hole of the propeller hub will be allowed in order to accept a larger diameter shaft and/or a bushing cut from metal tubing."

However they were certainly frowned upon and at least one shaft-mounted system made available commercially. Maybe the fact that Garami's have been used without being questioned is quietly leading to acceptance by default. Makes some sense for they are certainly the easiest freewheel clutch to make and install - as to use i guess much depends upon a CD's decision.
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Tmat
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« Reply #267 on: September 19, 2010, 03:05:40 PM »

My nephew Jack and I went flying early this morning (on the field just after sunrise) with the Pirate P-30. It was a lovely, calm, clear and crisp fall morning. There was traces of mist still around at the edges of the field which I love seeing in the fall.

The calm weather meant that we didn't have to go very far! I set the Burley E-timer for exactly 2 minutes and the little bird was DT'ing at about 20 to 30 feet high each flight. So I'd estimate that the still air performance is about 2:20 or so with the 1000 turns that I limit Jack to (May 09 Super Sport 6 strands of 1/8").

She certainly got up nice and high and floated around beautifully.

A nice morning and check out the grass at the field! Shocked

Tmat
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Pit
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« Reply #268 on: September 19, 2010, 03:18:23 PM »

He's gonna be giving you REAL competition very soon, Tony!
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« Reply #269 on: September 19, 2010, 03:23:31 PM »

Tony, So happy to see a youngster having fun in our hobby. I agree with Pete. You'll be shaking his hand very soon at the winners circle.

Caley
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NeilR
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« Reply #270 on: September 19, 2010, 06:06:04 PM »

You call that a flying field!! It has a tractor with a roller...where are the trees, the barbed wire fences, the tall grass, rabbit holes and logs hiding snakes...and the bull in the next field!
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danberry
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« Reply #271 on: September 19, 2010, 08:39:57 PM »

Tony, the plane looks great. The flyer looks great. The fin looks .... invisible!!?!!
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Rewinged
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« Reply #272 on: September 19, 2010, 10:38:03 PM »

Yeah, there's no challenge at all flying on a field like that. (Or with a model like that!)

Really great pics, field, plane, flyer, and story.

--Bill
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Tapio Linkosalo
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« Reply #273 on: September 20, 2010, 01:06:33 AM »

How much is the diameter of the Burley fuselage tube? How much is the weight? Does it accommodate the 6 strand motor with bunches?

The method of manufacturing seems quite neat; I suppose it is laminated on a larger diameter mold as a warped sheet (for easy removal), and then the seam with overlap is glued when the laminate has cured?
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Tmat
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« Reply #274 on: September 20, 2010, 09:21:52 AM »

Thanks guys, Jack and I had a lot of fun with the P-30, and yes, the field is tough to deal with... Grin

Tapio, I'll measure the diameter of the fuselage. It is by andre Burdov by the way. There are two versions (both the same size) one in fiberglass, and the other is Kevlar. Yes, the diameter is large enough to accommodate a 6 strand motor. Bunches? Of bananas? Grin

I'll weigh it for you too.

I'm assuming that it is molded around a male mandrel, but I suppose it could have been made from cured sheet?

Tony
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